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let's give this some thoguht ... and lego blocks

Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2001 12:09 am
by The Que
OK ... I have to admit after takin a break to work on some other stuff I've lost lots of information on how phpbb has been coming along.

but since this portal idea has come along I'e been very interested again to see how everything turns out.

reading through a few threads I couldn't help but to make a comment.

I'm wondering if some serious thought should be givento what is happening here. I wonder if phpbb and the new portal shouldn't be re-thought out in how this is gonna be worked on.

I see the flames coming already butthishas been in my thoughts for the past week now.

I suggest that phpbb2 should be released and full feature stopped as it stands (err finish some minor details if need be but add nothing new)

then

rip it apart again! and break it up into lego blocks.

then use those blocks as the basis to all new software that will come from what ever is gonna be thought up in the coming future.

think about it ... a BB now a portal, what is next ??? if phpbb is gonna stop at what it is fine ... but I see more than that coming.

People are also clamoring for a system that they have more control over.

plug-an-play type of functionality ... so I guess a CMS system is close to what many want but they want more ... ease of use...ease of changing ... ease of fitting into their own idea of a web site.

ok, I'm starting to ramble but do you know what I'm saying?

why templates? why not a huge library of reusable functions.

I'm not a programmer but on my site I have this file which contains lots of functions that you would normally included in the regualr html files. then I just call that function from my html which in turns either builds the html block I want or calls a script for me.

This way I can redesign my site very quickly and easily -- of course I'm probably taking a performance hit since I'm sure this could be done much better by a programmer but heh what's an extra second.

I'mnot complaining or even talking about phpbb coding just the way things are being errrr "managed" (for a lack of a better word) I think the coding andideas are great just these need to be converted into a system that many people will find easy to use and easy to implement.

I'm in a rush so ... if anybody comments on thisidea I'll try to expand from there ... I'm finding it hard to write down what I'm thinking right now.

Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2001 12:18 am
by dizzywalker
We wrote an (can I use swear words in phpBB) ASP Content Management System for our Intranet which uses the phpBB Users database to authenticate (ODBC).

So a combination Portal and CMS could be really useful, if that's what you are suggesting?

We give different access and user rights to edit their owned pages, all the text and files are help in a MySQL db, so it requires little maintence apart from template design. But I hate ASP, so this sounds good to me.


PS: Does anyone know a good ASP to PHP migration tool, I tried ASP2PHP but it doesn't seem to work too well?

Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2001 12:21 am
by psoTFX
Not quite sure how often we need to say this ... phpBB Groups major 'product' is phpBB, not the portal. The portal is going to be developed separately from phpBB but with input to and from the teams. Much of 2.0's core is reuseable in the portal, and those bits which may cause difficulty will be noted and where possible compromises introduced. However, just to reiterate, we're producing a bulletin board here, not a CMS.

Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2001 12:27 am
by Pit
Perhaps you should put that in the registering disclaimer. :D

Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2001 12:28 am
by BartVB
It's not really a CMS either, I thing The Que is talking Application Server here.

IMO we will be over aiming if we do that.

We can provide the basics for building a site but IMO we shouldn't aim at creating a complete application framework.

It's nice to have reusable modules (like we already have in a way) but IMO we will make things a LOT more complex (and slower) if we start breaking everything apart.

My guess is that phpBB2 will become a bit more modular (maybe in part because of the Portal) but that's as far as we should go :D

We can provide some basic services as templates, plugin system, search engine, authentification, userbase, etc but we should keep it aimed at the forum..

It's a good idea that you have but IMO we should try to stick to our core business :D

Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2001 12:35 am
by psoTFX
BartVB wrote: It's not really a CMS either, I thing The Que is talking Application Server here.

Whatever it is, we agreed when 'going with the portal' that our core remained phpBB (which may bend a little to accomodate some portal requirements) ... so the continuing 'discussions' of "You're doing it all wrong" are quite moot. If we were changing tack and moving towards a CMS (or whatever) as our 'basic product' then I'd agree with comments from both Vandal and Que, but that isn't the case.

Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2001 12:35 am
by dizzywalker
Sorry, got carried away when I saw the chance to get rid of ASP. I won't do it again :oops:

Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2001 3:32 am
by The Que
ummm ... really sorry that I'm not experessing myself very clear here ... I have this image of what "can be done with" the work that has come out of phpbb ... ummm "You're doing it all wrong" is way to harash for what I'm thinking or suggesting ... or am I just kidding myself.

I'm not suggesting that this should be done yesterday but more of a what is the next phase or life of phpbb.

OR is the phpbb team just out to make only a BB and that's it? IF this is so I can understand and won't question your personal reasons but ... the "what if you're not" is sticing in the back of my throat like a fish bone.

phpbb 1.x.x and 2.x.x are great, on top of which lots of talent is gathering here. Why stop at a BB?

Honestly speaking the phpbb group and thegroup at gossamer-threads are my hero's ... awhile ago gossamer wasat the same point only a few products but they're expanding big time and I don't see why a similar group couldn't do the same for the php world.

But if phpbb is to stay as is and leave other off shots to off shot groups ... wht ever I think or say isn't going to matter I guess .. so be the higher powers.

hmmm Bart is the closest to what I'm thinking. .... modular but independent but interdependent ... a framework when added together but not a "this is it - use it like we designed it "nuke" thingy" but more of "this is an example - have fun folks" type of idea.

am I making any sense?

Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2001 4:17 am
by Jay
i think some of your questions here have already been answered in other threads... as far as i can tell phpBB is going to stay an independate project for the Portal.. however the phpBB team has said that they will work with us etc.. but make no major changes to phpBB etc.. anyway.. you should go read some of the older threads here...

Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2001 7:16 am
by gameofhit
The Que wrote: Why stop at a BB?


While what you are saying is true, and would be cool, it just isn't practical. Them phpBB folk have their hands plenty full with the BB. If you've read through the forums at all, you can see that there are countless feature requests, to the point that they are locked on sight.

I am glad that they are going to stick just to the BB, I can't wait to see what happens with it in the future. 8)

If another group were to start this "beyond BB" project, that would be great, but I am glad that the group is going to stick with improving what they have. 8)

Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2001 1:16 am
by vandal
please read some of the threads I have started .. alot of what you were saying was discussed there

also in terms of the function calls inside the html:
this just does not fly :)

of course this gives you the maximal flexibility
but it also results in
poor portability
poor seperation of responsibility (design and content generation)
and its just generally a bad idea :)