ACP Private Messages: Wording could be better

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Heo32
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Mon May 06, 2019 8:18 am
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Heo32
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ACP Private Messages: Wording could be better

Post by Heo32 » Mon May 06, 2019 8:18 am

This is an easy change since it involves text.

ACP > Permissions (tab) > User roles > Private Messages (tab)


I noticed 3 of these lines could be changed for consistency and clarification with respect to the others available from the list.

From:
  • Can send messages to multiple users
  • Can send messages to groups
To:
  • Can send private messages to multiple users
  • Can send private messages to groups
The word "private" is added because all of the other options have it.


I was a bit confused by this last one since the first option above mentions that private messages can be sent to multiple users, it made me wonder if this had to be enabled in order to make the sending of private messages work work at all.

From
  • Can send private messages
To:
  • Can send private messages to users

Consistent and clear:
  • Can send private messages to multiple users
  • Can send private messages to groups
  • Can send private messages to users
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Re: ACP Private Messages: Wording could be better

Post by david63 » Mon May 06, 2019 9:07 am

This would be better in the Bug Tracker, or even creating a PR
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Re: ACP Private Messages: Wording could be better

Post by Heo32 » Mon May 06, 2019 9:28 am

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Re: ACP Private Messages: Wording could be better

Post by mrgoldy » Mon May 06, 2019 2:39 pm

I think that the "Can send private messages", if set to "no", also doesn't allow sending private messages to groups or multiple users.
It's a general option, if the Private Message system should be available to that user or not.
So adding "to users" will be misleading then.
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Re: ACP Private Messages: Wording could be better

Post by Lumpy Burgertushie » Mon May 06, 2019 5:46 pm

also , you are already in the private message section. so , no need to say "private message".

the whole point of PMs is to send them to users. you can't send them to people that are not users so why is "users" needed anywhere except to differentiate from groups?

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Re: ACP Private Messages: Wording could be better

Post by Heo32 » Tue May 07, 2019 12:17 pm

mrgoldy wrote:
Mon May 06, 2019 2:39 pm
I think that the "Can send private messages", if set to "no", also doesn't allow sending private messages to groups or multiple users.
It's a general option, if the Private Message system should be available to that user or not.
So adding "to users" will be misleading then.
I just tested it and you are correct. That introduces an issue since the only way to enable private messaging to a group is to also allow private messages to individual users as well.

If a forum owner wishes to set up user roles so that groups are able to receive private messages while also disallowing that group to be able to private message users, then there is currently no way to have that as an option. The only way to private message anyone, be it multiple users and/or groups, is to have "Can send private messages" selected in the first place. This is not flexible.

When a user role is made and set with "Can send messages to multiple users" and/or "Can send messages to groups", then that is what they should do when those two options are selected, but they don't work unless "Can send private messages" is also checked. Those two options alone are not specifying that a user role is able to send private messages to individual users.

Instead of allowing private messages to be enabled for multiple users, groups and users by selecting "Can send private messages", it should be replaced with "Can send private messages to users" with that specific task granted for the sake of flexibility.

Specifying what is wanted to the following 3 options covers all of the bases with clear, desired and intended results:
  • to multiple users
  • to groups
  • to users
- If multiple users is selected only, allow private messages to be sent to multiple users, but not groups or individuals.
- If groups is selected only, allow private messages to be sent to groups, but not multiple users or individuals.
- If users is selected only, allow private messages to be sent to users, but not multiple users or groups.
- If all 3 are selected, allow private messages to be sent to multiple users, groups and users.
- Etc.
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Re: ACP Private Messages: Wording could be better

Post by Brf » Tue May 07, 2019 1:27 pm

When you are sending a private message to a group, you are actually sending it to individual users in that group. The "Can send to groups" and "Can send to multiple users" is intended for board leaders to be able to send mass messages. It can be turned off for individual users to prevent them from spamming a message to a bunch of users at once.

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Re: ACP Private Messages: Wording could be better

Post by AmigoJack » Wed May 08, 2019 7:16 am

Brf wrote:
Tue May 07, 2019 1:27 pm
When you are sending a private message to a group, you are actually sending it to individual users in that group.
I object: the recipient is the group name alone and neither the sender nor any reader has the chance to see who else got it (looking up the members of a group doesn't guarantee nobody left or entered the group since the PM was composed).

Heo32 wrote:
Tue May 07, 2019 12:17 pm
That introduces an issue
Thru the years I modified an installation to also have more granular permission options (or adding a group type where not even members would know who else is in there). Consider it as "crossing the line" between your individual needs and what phpBB provided for years already - it won't be the last encounter of wanting finer adjustments that most likely the majority of administrators don't care of.
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Re: ACP Private Messages: Wording could be better

Post by Heo32 » Thu May 09, 2019 8:50 am

AmigoJack wrote:
Wed May 08, 2019 7:16 am
Thru the years I modified an installation to also have more granular permission options (or adding a group type where not even members would know who else is in there). Consider it as "crossing the line" between your individual needs and what phpBB provided for years already - it won't be the last encounter of wanting finer adjustments that most likely the majority of administrators don't care of.
You understand perfectly. For my needs, I want certain groups to be able to private message the Administrators group only, which is me, but not be able to private message each other.

If this change were to be applied so it is in phpBB, I would be very happy. If not, I'll understand.
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stevemaury wrote:
Sun May 20, 2018 8:16 pm
I went to your board and looked for an hour or so, but did not see the women without underwear.

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