what does Easter mean?

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Green Light
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Re: what does Easter mean?

Post by Green Light » Thu Apr 08, 2010 5:09 am

Highway of Life wrote:...
Atheism itself is a religion, it’s the belief in no God, or for some, it’s knowing that there is a God but not accepting of this, the desire to prove that there is no God. If there was really no God, why should you care what I believe? Living without God, what does your life mean? What happens to you after death, do you and your soul cease to exist? Then what are you doing waisting what little time you have left posting on a bulletin board, your life and thoughts are finite, wouldn’t you rather be doing something? It’s as if a Christian is that child who believes in Santa Claus, and you have a personal mission to tell that child and every other child that he doesn’t exist. Why? Are you really accomplishing anything important? What defines important without God?
...
Atheism is not a religion, it's not a belief, I'm saying there aren't any gods, how is that a belief. There nothing to question there.. yet with religion and believing in god there are millions of questions.
I really don't give, what you care about.. but, it's those who tell me that there is a god that make me care.. Because it's a lie, that's why I care, Your lying to me..(at least that's what I believe) that's like telling me santa does exist, yet he doesn't..
Who said we have souls? Nothing happens after you die, I'm not worried that my like is finite. Because when I'm dead it'll be impossible to care.

What defines important without god? What do you mean, are you saying I need god to help me classify things? Whatever I feel is important is important to me, I don't need Yahoo Answers for that. :roll:

I'm curious, what happens when you die, do you goto heaven or do jews, islams, etc, go? Are they separate heavens? Or when jews die, god greets them telling them they made the wrong choice it was Christianity now goto hell. :P

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Highway of Life
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Re: what does Easter mean?

Post by Highway of Life » Thu Apr 08, 2010 5:25 am

Define credibility. According to who? You? Who gave you the authority to dictate what religion is credible, or that religions are not credible? How do you know that any religion has either greater or lesser credibility than another religion, or than Atheism.

What makes what you say any more credible than what I say when there is no absolute truth? By your logic, you cannot declare that God does not exist any more than I can declare that he does exist. So where does that leave us?

You don’t believe in God, I get that, but you cannot stand that I can declare that there is an almighty Father God, creator of heaven and earth, what is seen and unseen, in Jesus Christ, his only Son, our Lord. If God does not exist, why is it so important that you must disprove his existence?
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Green Light
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Re: what does Easter mean?

Post by Green Light » Thu Apr 08, 2010 5:41 am

Highway of Life wrote:Define credibility. According to who? You? Who gave you the authority to dictate what religion is credible, or that religions are not credible? How do you know that any religion has either greater or lesser credibility than another religion, or than Atheism.

What makes what you say any more credible than what I say when there is no absolute truth? By your logic, you cannot declare that God does not exist any more than I can declare that he does exist. So where does that leave us?

You don’t believe in God, I get that, but you cannot stand that I can declare that there is an almighty Father God, creator of heaven and earth, what is seen and unseen, in Jesus Christ, his only Son, our Lord. If God does not exist, why is it so important that you must disprove his existence?
That leaves us no-where in a debate like this, nobody can do anything.. No matter how many times I try to convince you or how many times you try and convince me, it leaves us both no-where.. That's where this debate heads too.. maybe that's a reason people goto war and solve they're beliefs there.

I don't care that much that I'll kill over it, that's what extremist are for.

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Re: what does Easter mean?

Post by Highway of Life » Thu Apr 08, 2010 8:49 am

Hey Green Light, I must apologize, I had not seen your post come in by the time I posted mine, went to dinner, just got back and realized that you had posted before me. My reply therefore appeared to be directed at you, which it was not. :)

I’ll go ahead and reply to it now...

Most atheists take pride in their intellectual ability and like to think that they have no “beliefs.” However, modern science has shown us that everyone has beliefs, since this is how our brains work. Although we would like to think that everything we believe is based upon evidence and logic, this is simply not true. In fact, we become emotionally bound to our worldview, so much so that worldview changes occur rarely, if at all.

Beliefs are defined as “an acceptance that a statement is true or that something exists”, “something one accepts as true or real”, or “a firmly held opinion or conviction”. So do you mean to tell me that atheists do not accept any statement as true, or anything that exists? A person who claims to not hold any beliefs, a person who holds neither faith nor disbelief in God, would be an agnostic. “Agnosticism is the view that the truth value of certain claims—especially claims about the existence or non-existence of any deity, but also other religious and metaphysical claims—is unknown or unknowable.” But Atheism is defined as the belief that God does not exist. Therefore, if this is your belief, you in-fact do have beliefs.

Religion is defined as:
1) The belief in and worship of a superhuman controller power, such as a God or gods.
2) A set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature, and purpose of the universe.

So do Atheists not hold any beliefs concerning the cause, nature and purpose of the universe? Which essentially means, they do not know. That is likely, but is that your belief? Do you know?

Now lets address the question of belief in God being a lie.
If someone on this message board posted a topic convinced that they have an imaginary friend, how hard would you try to convince them otherwise? Would you care?

Look at the world around us, isn’t it an amazing cosmic accident? Teeming with life and intelligent beings, animals, and humans, who have created machines, materials, who have figured out how to fly. Isn’t it amazing how that all happened by accident? That is some very intelligent evolution at work, guided by nothing but.. instinct. But where did instinct come from? Osmosis? Cosmic soup? Where did the cosmic soup come from? How did it get created? The intelligent cosmic bang we now call the “Big Bang Theory”? Out of one big massive explosion came accidental planets, developed life from stupid... or intelligent? molecules? How did these molecules get to be so smart?

Can we know the answers to all of these questions, or is there an explanation for them? The big question of... how? So is there really more questions for a belief in God? When you believe in God, the answers to those questions are a lot easier answers. That’s why we call it Intelligent Design.
But belief in God is not about how things come about, it’s not all about science, it’s about a relationship.
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Re: what does Easter mean?

Post by Green Light » Thu Apr 08, 2010 6:07 pm

Highway of Life wrote:
Most atheists take pride in their intellectual ability and like to think that they have no “beliefs.” However, modern science has shown us that everyone has beliefs, since this is how our brains work. Although we would like to think that everything we believe is based upon evidence and logic, this is simply not true. In fact, we become emotionally bound to our worldview, so much so that worldview changes occur rarely, if at all.

Beliefs are defined as “an acceptance that a statement is true or that something exists”, “something one accepts as true or real”, or “a firmly held opinion or conviction”. So do you mean to tell me that atheists do not accept any statement as true, or anything that exists? A person who claims to not hold any beliefs, a person who holds neither faith nor disbelief in God, would be an agnostic. “Agnosticism is the view that the truth value of certain claims—especially claims about the existence or non-existence of any deity, but also other religious and metaphysical claims—is unknown or unknowable.” But Atheism is defined as the belief that God does not exist. Therefore, if this is your belief, you in-fact do have beliefs.
If it makes you happy than I'll say I dis-believe in god.
Religion is defined as:
1) The belief in and worship of a superhuman controller power, such as a God or gods.
2) A set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature, and purpose of the universe.

So do Atheists not hold any beliefs concerning the cause, nature and purpose of the universe? Which essentially means, they do not know. That is likely, but is that your belief? Do you know?
People think each and every atheists is the same.. There not, basically it's someone who doesn't think god exists. Anything after that has nothing to do with atheists. I can't say I know for sure, but I would never think god made the universe.. My bets on the big bang theory.
Now lets address the question of belief in God being a lie.
If someone on this message board posted a topic convinced that they have an imaginary friend, how hard would you try to convince them otherwise? Would you care?
First off I would laugh.Who whouldn't. I do many times when I stumble upon dumb religious stories... atheists worst nightmare.
Many atheists just put up with it.. some don't and tell them off.. I wouldn't care, sucks for them that they still believe in imaginary friends.
Look at the world around us, isn’t it an amazing cosmic accident? Teeming with life and intelligent beings, animals, and humans, who have created machines, materials, who have figured out how to fly. Isn’t it amazing how that all happened by accident? That is some very intelligent evolution at work, guided by nothing but.. instinct. But where did instinct come from? Osmosis? Cosmic soup? Where did the cosmic soup come from? How did it get created? The intelligent cosmic bang we now call the “Big Bang Theory”? Out of one big massive explosion came accidental planets, developed life from stupid... or intelligent? molecules? How did these molecules get to be so smart?
Nah, the big bang theory is dumbest theory ever, I'll go with that an imaginary god created the whole universe in 7 days.. seems like a more plausible explanation.
Can we know the answers to all of these questions, or is there an explanation for them? The big question of... how? So is there really more questions for a belief in God? When you believe in God, the answers to those questions are a lot easier answers. That’s why we call it Intelligent Design.
But belief in God is not about how things come about, it’s not all about science, it’s about a relationship.
Why do you believe in god? Are you just hoping you go-to heaven? I would love to goto heaven, but why keep your hopes up.. I guess it wouldn't really matter if you did keep your hopes up.. because when someones dead they can't think, they no longer have a conscious.. your just dead..
Who wrote these answers? God? No.. people who made the religion.
Give me some paper I'll go write my own prophet.. No one says it's true 100% fact, but who cares it's an answer right?

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Re: what does Easter mean?

Post by Darth Wong » Mon Apr 12, 2010 12:58 am

MasterZ wrote:
Darth Wong wrote:There is precisely zero evidence for intelligent design. The things people think of as evidence for intelligent design are always just things we don't understand yet (or which creationists think we don't understand yet).
So if it is something you disagree with then it cannot be evidence at all and has to be just fictional with no scientific background whatsoever? Wow, your scientific process seems a lot like what happened in the dark ages... "Agree with me or else!"
Not because it disagrees with me, but because it does not meet the scientific definition of evidence, at all. The problem is that people like you don't have any scientific training, which would be fine except that you think you're qualified to judge scientific theories anyway. Because of your lack of scientific training, you have no idea what constitutes scientific evidence. You think it's just about who shouts the loudest, or who says something that feels right to you.

In order to test a scientific theory, you must first understand its mechanism, Then you can use its mechanism to produce specific predictions which differ from those of competing theories. Then you test these predictions. Intelligent design is completely incapable of doing this, because it makes no testable predictions.

Tell me, can you describe a species which would disprove intelligent design? One and a half centuries ago, Darwin laid down a challenge, and described several types of species which, if discovered, would disprove the theory of evolution. No one has ever found a species conforming to his specifications. Meanwhile, intelligent design makes no specific predictions: it is so vague that it is incapable of defining a type of species which would disprove intelligent design.
Darth Wong wrote:The fact that other religious people wrote books agreeing with you does not validate your claims.
And the fact that other atheists wrote a book agreeing with your claims is different somehow?
Peer-reviewed scientific literature, not just some book you can order from Amazon.

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Re: what does Easter mean?

Post by Darth Wong » Mon Apr 12, 2010 1:08 am

Highway of Life wrote:Define credibility. According to who? You? Who gave you the authority to dictate what religion is credible, or that religions are not credible? How do you know that any religion has either greater or lesser credibility than another religion, or than Atheism.
All religions have lesser credibility than atheism, because every religion not only presumes that a god exists but describes specific characteristics of him. That's not just one, but a whole boatload of assumptions. You may say that atheism assumes gods do not exist, but I can point out that religions do not stop at saying some kind of god exists. They go on, and sell you all kinds of stories, specific lifestyle recommendations, and all manner of other specific claims about these gods.

In short, the worst thing you can say about atheism is that it makes one claim which cannot be absolutely proven. But a typical religion makes thousands of such claims, because it does not stop with "some kind of god exists". It goes much farther, with much more detail, and all of those details are unproven assumptions.
What makes what you say any more credible than what I say when there is no absolute truth? By your logic, you cannot declare that God does not exist any more than I can declare that he does exist. So where does that leave us?
Do you declare that the Easter Bunny does not exist? What makes you think the idea of God is any more credible? Do you understand the logical principle of parsimony?

If you reject the logical principle of parsimony, you should be aware that you have an unusually disprovable religion, because it is monotheistic. I can use that to show that the probability of its correctness approaches zero. First, let us take several premises:

1) In the absence of scientific evidence favouring one religion over another, every religion is equally likely to be true.
2) For a monotheistic religion to be true, all other religions must be false.

Therefore, if there are X possible religions, then the probability of a monotheistic religion being correct is 1/X. However, there are an infinite number of possible religions. Therefore, if you ignore the logical principle of parsimony and assume that some religion must be true, the probability of a monotheistic religion being true is 1/infinity, which approaches zero.

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Re: what does Easter mean?

Post by Darth Wong » Mon Apr 12, 2010 1:10 am

Highway of Life wrote:Most atheists take pride in their intellectual ability and like to think that they have no “beliefs.” However, modern science has shown us that everyone has beliefs, since this is how our brains work. Although we would like to think that everything we believe is based upon evidence and logic, this is simply not true. In fact, we become emotionally bound to our worldview, so much so that worldview changes occur rarely, if at all.
This is the ad-hominem fallacy: attacking the logical argument by attacking the weaknesses of its author. Yes, atheists have the same emotional weaknesses as everyone else. However, that does not mean that atheism itself is emotionally flawed, any more than Newton's laws of motion are weakened by Newton's myriad personal flaws.

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Re: what does Easter mean?

Post by god0fgod » Mon Apr 12, 2010 1:40 pm

Did this topic need to get so philosophical?

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Re: what does Easter mean?

Post by Rhet-or-Ric » Mon Apr 12, 2010 4:30 pm

.
god0fgod wrote: Did this topic need to get so philosophical?
Well, I am partial to white Easter Bunnies, chocolates in my Easter Basket, and plain colored eggs.

I'm afraid I'm not too good at finding Easter Eggs during that activity because I much rather sit on the sidelines and eat my chocolate. I get my Easter Eggs by begging. Much easier, as everyone is in such a giving mood when they have just been given something for free. I mean, those Easter Eggs are hardly ever hidden in difficult places, so it's like giving them away for little effort.

"And that's all I've got to say about that."

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