Finally some good news!!

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JimA
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Re: Finally some good news!!

Post by JimA » Mon Sep 23, 2019 11:39 am

I don't usually get involved in topics like these, they tend to get heated, but since I do enjoy political discussions I'll join here. :)

warmweer wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:46 pm
which the majority of those who voted were for Brexit. not everyone who was entitled to vote, actually voted and most of those were anti-Brexit (according to a BBC analysis the brexiteers were a lot more inclined to vote than the non-brexiteers).
Let me start off by saying that personally I think like Brexit is one of the worst things that the UK could have done (or do) to itself. But to say that the results of a vote is not how everybody feels because not everybody voted is a bit of weak argument, in my opinion. Go out and vote, then. This might be an imperfect system, but all adults have had their chance to vote. If you didn't, you shouldn't whine afterwards.

warmweer wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:46 pm
Also, quite a large group (the younger ones who where not yet entitled to vote, lacking a couple of months) didn't have a say in it - but now more than 2 years later they are stuck with the results of a dubious campaign which used false data
You'll always keep this "issue". If you'd re-do the vote now, there would also be new 16 and 17 year olds that would just miss out. You have to draw the line somewhere. Let's face it, if they were to re-do the referendum now the result would probably be quite different, mainly as much of this false data has now been proven wrong but that's not what democracy is. You cannot keep doing new referendums until you get a result you like. The rules of the original referendum were clear and the people have spoken, even though they objectively made a big mistake.
Lumpy Burgertushie wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:12 pm
the people that keep calling him a liar can not produce any proof/examples when called on it
Really? ;)
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Re: Finally some good news!!

Post by Mick » Mon Sep 23, 2019 12:49 pm

I have to say I’ve been anti-EU from day one when it was the “European Communities”. I voted against it in the first place when it was a simple trade agreement (EC). We (Britain) never signed up for the juggernaut it has become today. It was supposed to be a trade agreement, nothing more but now we have non-elected people in Brussels lawmaking which I certainly don’t want and I suspect the majority of Brits don’t either. Let me add, at the age of 68 and living through all this hoohah, I can’t think of one thing the EU has done or improved for me apart from having stupid laws thrust upon us. IMHO Britain shouldn’t have got involved in the first place.
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Re: Finally some good news!!

Post by Lumpy Burgertushie » Mon Sep 23, 2019 4:45 pm

JimA wrote:
Mon Sep 23, 2019 11:39 am
Lumpy Burgertushie wrote: ↑
Thu Sep 12, 2019 4:12 pm
the people that keep calling him a liar can not produce any proof/examples when called on it

Really?
I sincerely hope that you don't base all your opinions on any so called "fact check" organization.

In general, they are usually biased to one ideology or the other and politifact.com is known to be pretty biased to the left here in the US.

just do a search for fact check and bias.


robert

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Dan Stylez
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Re: Finally some good news!!

Post by Dan Stylez » Mon Sep 23, 2019 9:39 pm

What does Donald Trump do? he throws childish insults around, he encourages hatred.

The day after the El Paso and Ohio shootings, Don steps off his helicopter heads over to the reporters, gives a 2 minute sorry / thoughts are with etc and then a minute later says "we've done more than the previous administrations and Obama to stop gun crime - using mass shootings to play to your political base is low.

He comes to the UK, says there was a "small protest" and he hardly noticed it, everyone with eyes saw it - but his supporters believe it didn't happen.

Don't get me wrong, the media and CNN give him a very hard time, even if he does something good they will find a stick to beat him down with - but expressing the immature views he has in public - you won't make many friends for sure.
Lumpy Burgertushie wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:12 pm
Dan Stylez wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 5:40 pm
I'm thankful we live in a country where mass shootings aren't "the norm"
nope just mass stabbings and acid attacks
By mass shootings I mean a man entering a building and taking aim at 5/10 or more people.
We have a lot of stabbings and acid attacks but they are usually targetted I/E gang members at war, scorned husband etc.
Thankfully not people going into a shopping centre or a school and shooting 10 random innocent people.

They say that some kids in America go to school expecting a mass shooting to take place at their school - we 100% do not have that here in England.
That ain't no life is it, kids should be enjoying their life not living in fear... maybe the answer is getting a president who is about 40, not an OAP whose views are outdated and full of hatred.

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Re: Finally some good news!!

Post by Random American » Sat Oct 05, 2019 6:04 pm

He is probably going to be forced to ask for another delay. This probably isn't going to end any time soon.

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Re: Finally some good news!!

Post by bonelifer » Sat Oct 05, 2019 6:35 pm

warmweer wrote:
Wed Sep 04, 2019 2:51 pm
</Solidjeuh> wrote:
Wed Sep 04, 2019 11:22 am
So tired of that stupid brexit news everyday :cry:
I think the whole of Europe is, and not only about the Brexit.
I still can't fathom how the so-called civilised world can be "mislead" by campaigns full of incorrect, even outright false information. One would think the historic events leading to the World Wars (and other crises) would serve as an example on how to NOT let a country be governed by narcissistic demagogs. I'm a firm believer in democracy but lately I've started to have doubts about the "demos" part.
My dad was in the US Army for 22 years. I was born in Landstuhl, Rheinland-Pfalz, "West Germany". Recently while in the hospital, I was chatting with my nurse(RN) while they took my vitals. I mentioned this, and they were like "West What?". It also seems like they must of dropped "CIVICS" classes since I was a high school freshman(1994). People have no clue how our government actually works. If they don't know those things, I think they probably aren't teaching or at least remembering their history classes. Short attention spans or just really boring teachers. One of my high school history teachers, brought his father in for our World War 2 lesson. Complete with the shrapnel, he was hit with while serving on a B-17 bomber. Another teacher, a former US Army Airborne Ranger Captain(Vietnam era/early 80's), had plenty of interesting ideas about JFK/Cuba, etc. Maybe today's teachers are just boring as hell or the people creating our current curriculum are trying to dumb down the populace in order to control them. Both seem just as likely as the other.
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Re: Finally some good news!!

Post by david63 » Sat Oct 05, 2019 8:51 pm

Random American wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 6:04 pm
He is probably going to be forced to ask for another delay. This probably isn't going to end any time soon.
I do wish the press would get their facts correct - he does not have to ask for a delay but an extension which are not the same. And asking for an extension does not actually change anything.

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Re: Finally some good news!!

Post by Random American » Sat Oct 05, 2019 9:28 pm

david63 wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 8:51 pm
Random American wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 6:04 pm
He is probably going to be forced to ask for another delay. This probably isn't going to end any time soon.
I do wish the press would get their facts correct - he does not have to ask for a delay but an extension which are not the same. And asking for an extension does not actually change anything.
Well, that's embarrassing. So it won't give them any more time to negotiate a deal?

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Re: Finally some good news!!

Post by canonknipser » Sat Oct 05, 2019 9:56 pm

Following the original timeline of two years after triggering article 50, Brexit should have happend on March 29th, 2019, which is now more than six month in the past.
The summary of the process you can find here: https://researchbriefings.parliament.uk ... y/CBP-7960

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Re: Finally some good news!!

Post by Random American » Sat Oct 05, 2019 10:14 pm

Thanks.

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Re: Finally some good news!!

Post by warmweer » Sat Oct 12, 2019 10:50 am

JimA wrote:
Mon Sep 23, 2019 11:39 am
...But to say that the results of a vote is not how everybody feels because not everybody voted is a bit of weak argument, in my opinion. Go out and vote, then. This might be an imperfect system, but all adults have had their chance to vote. If you didn't, you shouldn't whine afterwards.

...

You'll always keep this "issue". If you'd re-do the vote now, there would also be new 16 and 17 year olds that would just miss out. You have to draw the line somewhere. Let's face it, if they were to re-do the referendum now the result would probably be quite different, mainly as much of this false data has now been proven wrong but that's not what democracy is. You cannot keep doing new referendums until you get a result you like. The rules of the original referendum were clear and the people have spoken, even though they objectively made a big mistake.
I agree with you on both points BUT the referendum "made" a decision which (if followed through) cannot be counteracted anymore with elections. It's not like local elections where a change of policy has relatively immediate effect but after the next election things can be turned back. Also, all adults had their chance to vote" is incorrect: only UK citizens residing in the UK were entitled to vote (from what I have been told by my UK contacts living in Belgium and in Spain).

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Re: Finally some good news!!

Post by John connor » Sun Oct 13, 2019 7:13 am

Since cricket was mentioned. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dJxEc4RD0g

As far as the arm chair political warrior crap, I yield back the balance of my time. :lol:

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Re: Finally some good news!!

Post by warmweer » Sun Oct 13, 2019 9:26 am

John connor wrote:
Sun Oct 13, 2019 7:13 am
Since cricket was mentioned. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dJxEc4RD0g
:thumbsup:
Rumour has it the Brits want to leave Europe due to cricket not being accepted as The European unification sport ;) (can you blame Europe? :mrgreen: )

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Re: Finally some good news!!

Post by Wirral Talk » Sun Oct 13, 2019 4:01 pm

A lot of remainers give reasons why leavers voted leave, if they listened to leavers they might get nearer the truth and it is nothing to reading politician's lies plastered all over a buses.

My main reason for wanting Brexit is that it is easier to control/overthrow one rubbish Government than two rubbish Governments.

Earlier some said about the UK being a rich nation, we may be rich as a nation but the majority of the population are poor and up to their eyes in debt. Public spending has come down to below minimum, our road repairs are a disgrace as well as the many unrepaired roads, our health service (and life expectancy) is going backwards, our violent crime is going up, public transport is a joke. The country was a better and safer place to live in the 1960's than it is now.

Feel free to delete if this is too political.

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Re: Finally some good news!!

Post by warmweer » Sun Oct 13, 2019 5:11 pm

Wirral Talk wrote:
Sun Oct 13, 2019 4:01 pm
A lot of remainers give reasons why leavers voted leave, if they listened to leavers they might get nearer the truth and it is nothing to reading politician's lies plastered all over a buses.
Seriously, few leavers can explain exactly why they want to leave, apart from repeating political propaganda (having said this, it's the same with the majority of the remainers.)
Wirral Talk wrote:
Sun Oct 13, 2019 4:01 pm
My main reason for wanting Brexit is that it is easier to control/overthrow one rubbish Government than two rubbish Governments.
That's demagogic b*llshit and only focuses on the drawbacks of having extra legislation (which BTW is agreed upon through a system designed by representatives of all participating countries) AND leaves room for (too) many exceptions for specific countries (which is not something I'm a priori against).
Wirral Talk wrote:
Sun Oct 13, 2019 4:01 pm
Earlier some said about the UK being a rich nation, we may be rich as a nation but the majority of the population are poor and up to their eyes in debt. Public spending has come down to below minimum, our road repairs are a disgrace as well as the many unrepaired roads, our health service (and life expectancy) is going backwards, our violent crime is going up, public transport is a joke. The country was a better and safer place to live in the 1960's than it is now.
I agree that the UK (for that matter almost every single country whether it's EU or not) was a safer place but that has nothing to do with the EU. The problem with the EU is that it's a conglomerate of different governing systems (which as such isn't necessarily a bad thing) and that it's a bureaucratic highway full of potholes.

Whatever happens, both the UK and the EU will recover (eventually) but it's bound to leave a sour taste for years coming.
I just hope this charade is coming to an end soon (an extension of art.50 yes but not another 6 months of time and money wasting please).

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