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Re: The Coronavirus Topic

Posted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 7:29 am
by Tastenplayer
Robbie Williams - Staying alive ( Bee Gees ) "Coronaoke" live
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=04623kFAXq0
He's all torn up about the lockdown :roll:

Robbie Williams - I Want To Break Free (Queen)
Freddy would say: Can't you sing it yourself and above all better. Don't abuse my song so much!!!

Re: The Coronavirus Topic

Posted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 8:02 am
by 3Di
Tastenplayer wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 7:29 am
...
Robbie Williams - I Want To Break Free (Queen) ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wqYBQYHH_QY )
Freddy would say: Can't you sing it yourself and above all better. Don't abuse my song so much!!!
What a shame!

Re: The Coronavirus Topic

Posted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 9:02 am
by warmweer
John connor wrote:
Sat Jun 20, 2020 8:18 pm
Well, don't take my word for it FFS. Read and watch what two doctors are saying. I posted this since I heard about this way back in March.
March, eh? The links you mentioned are hardly fresher.
Anyway. What are the current guidelines? Ever considered guidelines are prone to change with new information? (AFAIR corona wasn't even a problem and would miraculously disappear by April anyway)
John connor wrote:
Sat Jun 20, 2020 8:18 pm
If you feel like you're more superior to a doctor who's writing death certificates, then that's your problem.
Try to focus on the facts instead of fighting everything I write.
Fact: number of deaths is severely in excess of average number of deaths in this period of the year.
Fact: corona is a new factor this year and contributes to the excess death number
Fact: the numbered of deaths classified as resulting from corona: is about 70% of this excess deaths number.

Question : what about the missing 30%?

Re: The Coronavirus Topic

Posted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 10:55 am
by JimA
warmweer wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 9:02 am
Fact: the numbered of deaths classified as resulting from corona: is about 70% of this excess deaths number.
Question : what about the missing 30%?
I haven't read everything you guys said in this discussion, so I might well make a point that you have as well. :)

But I think that the measure we should look at right now is the "excess excess deaths", if that makes any sense. Try to compare the excess death toll numbers with the average numbers of the last few years. The increase that you see in 2020 over the average from the last few years is in all likelihood for the overwhelming part due to the coronavirus crisis. This might not be the best measure (since some elderly people that would normally pass away from other diseases in a year, like the flu, could now very well pass away from the coronavirus) but it's the closest we will probably get to properly evaluating how many people really died per country due to this disease. I know that at least in the Netherlands here it gives us a much more realistic prediction than the official numbers do, according to the experts.

Re: The Coronavirus Topic

Posted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 12:40 pm
by david63
The bottom line about the number of deaths from Covid-19 is that we will never know the actual number from any country, let alone the world.

No matter how many numbers, I refrain from using statistics, are published it will always be an estimated number of deaths.

The only reasonably accurate figure will be the number of deaths for the whole year from any cause - and that may well be suspect from some countries. Yes that number can be compared against the previous year, or an average of the last n years, but that is all it will ever be - a comparison.

At the end of the day it matters little what anybody dies from, the result is the same. The only people interested in the analysis are the statisticians (so that they can justify their existence) and the politicians (usually from the opposition parties!)

Re: The Coronavirus Topic

Posted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 1:04 pm
by JimA
david63 wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 12:40 pm
At the end of the day it matters little what anybody dies from, the result is the same. The only people interested in the analysis are the statisticians (so that they can justify their existence) and the politicians (usually from the opposition parties!)
That's not completely true of course. Naturally, it matters what the cause of death is since you want to prevent things like this from happening again. If you know that the coronavirus deaths in your country are significantly more in a certain period as opposed to other countries, you know the way you tried to manage the outbreak was not efficient enough. That can help in improving conditions for a potential second wave in the second part of the year or for when a new outbreak of another virus comes along.

I do agree that it's always an estimate, but trying to get as close and accurate as possible and having the time frame as precise as possible is not just because statisticians like it. It can actually help save lives.

Re: The Coronavirus Topic

Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 7:40 am
by John connor
They don't even have one iota of Info. on how this virus spreads, etc. They say this one day, then the next it changes. I've heard masks don't work, then they say EVERYONE needs to wear a mask! I heard a doctor say the primary means of its spread is with your hands, then I hear the CDC doesn't believe you can get it from surfaces, etc. Last time they said the virus had a certain life expectancy based on the martial it was on.

All in all, this is like trying to predict when the super volcano in Yellowstone will go up, and if it does will it be big or small? I even read it will just be a lava flow. My ass it would be just a lava flow. So case in point here is that science is not 100% and data changes all the time. Don't EVEN get me started on "global warming/climate change." Been there done that on numerous forums for some 15 years.

Here's the thing. Science gets grant money from the government or whoever to do this and that and if they want to sway the data to their side the money talks and BS walks. Then when the government is control of the numbers and so-called "science" they don't know what they think they know and the sheep eat it up due to bureaucratic bull crap that is tossed to the media.

I think the biggest thing here is because of the media and social media every freaking thing has been blown out of proportion like a Twilight zone episode of the sun cooking the earth or some damn thing. This is principally why there was a major shortage of butt wipe and why people feel they need to wear a mask in their own car among a lot of other lack of common sense ideas about this, Captain Trips.


bureaucracy.jpg

Re: The Coronavirus Topic

Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 9:48 am
by Tastenplayer
My husband wanted to go to Greece in July. Because of the first anniversary of his sister's death, he wanted to go to Greece in July. I scolded him that no normal person would travel now. Especially not via Italy. I told him that when he came back he would have to have a test in the hospital first and only then could come home. That's why he finally said that he wouldn't travel.

How right I was! Corona has now also arrived in Paramythia - Epirus - Greece.
His brother recently said, "Don't come. We don't need Corona here.
In a village after the hometown of my husband, most of the houses are broken because of the earthquake.

The only question is who is going to eat the 3 shopping bags of chocolate. It could not be soon enough for him to start purchasing for GR :evil: . Just never listen to the women! And above all never believe them. He also complains every time I put on my mask for shopping. He says every time: you see someone else with a mask!? As long as I put on my smelly ffp2 mask, I don't care. It protects me anyway, unlike the blue mask from China, which only protects the other people but not me. The blue one must be worn by all people that it is of some use.

Image
I am seriously afraid that when the big summer holidays start traveling, the pandemic will start again a few weeks later. You could also take the opportunity to get to know your country of residence better! Even if holidays in Switzerland are hardly affordable for many people here. There one makes just holidays in balconies, garden, and surrounding areas. Many people do not even know the sights of their canton of residence.

Corona Rock · Weebow - New Side E.P - ℗ BRUNO RATER 06.2020
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=agfG2_236G4

Re: The Coronavirus Topic

Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 10:07 am
by warmweer
Not very obviously corona-related, but it is.

Fox news (in Politics) has an article titled: Trump signs exec order to give American workers a boost after pandemic lockdowns wreak havoc on jobs

Sounds like a reasonable action doesn't it? (but the link leads to something which doesn't quite fit the headline, which could be explained by some media expecting their public to read only headlines. ;) )

BBC has an article titled: Trump targets foreign workers with new visa freeze (at least that covers the content correctly).

And
Trump says he told his people too much coronavirus testing puts US at 'disadvantage,' contradicting staff
That stupid less intelligent remark was later "explained" as Trump's 'kidding' on testing.
My impression is that if the US has a disadvantage (compared to who/what?), it probably not due to corona but to the US' "leader" (or lack of).

Something totally different: as of past weekend In Belgium the corona statistics for Saturday, Sunday and Monday are published on Tuesday, the reason for this being that collecting an checking the data creates a lot of work for those who have to prepare the bulletins.
WTF?? For one, the hospitals and care centres still have to record and classify the data anyway and have to send to it to the Bureau of Statistics at the end of the day anyway. And what is published now are the cumulated numbers for Saturday, Sunday and Monday, not the daily data.Granted, it won't change anything to the overall picture but it's one of those typical Belgian "efficiency" measures. Ridiculous!

Re: The Coronavirus Topic

Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 3:11 pm
by warmweer
Media push 'explosion' of new COVID-19 cases in US, ignore important signs of improvement
This is probably Fox' way of trying give some "credibility" to Trump's statement (see previous post) about the "exaggerated testing" but how on earth any self respecting journalist can let this go on air is a mistery to me and frankly speaking this is flagrant and outright disinformation.

Fact : death rates are dropping.
That (plus the fact that in some states the number of daily number of new cases is dropping, and that the median age of those infected is dropping) is used as "proof".

Yes, death rates are dropping: simply because the age group most at risk has been affected already. This is noticeable in just about very country and in Belgium, which has a high percentage of elderly people and many of those live in care centres for the elderly there was no looking past that. Around end of April, almost 40% of fatalities where in the elderly group.

We're a lot further now in terms of preventing infection, and in terms of of identifying infection which in itself implies that treatment and care can start earlier plus a substantial part of the very susceptible elderly has already succumbed to the disease, so the median age, as well as the modal and average age of the dead will continue dropping - it's not rocket science.

As to the peak of the epidemic: Belgium is a small country and it was surprisingly easy to enforce the lockdown so no new external infections were introduced, and Belgians generally accepted the social distancing rules and the mask-advice so internal spreading was effectively reduced as far as possible.

The US is a lot larger and with no (or very late) nationwide lockdowns and a high level of resistance to the social distancing (and mask-wearing), controlling the outbreak has proven to be even more difficult. Some states are showing signs that it has reached a manageable level, but the infection reached some states a bit later than others and with lower population density in some states it doesn't spread that fast, but those now (or will soon) experience a peak.
In the US on the whole, the number of daily cases was more or less stable from April to end May, and even showed a slight tendency to drop, but since June the national count has been increasing gradually.
My definition of "improvement" (and the dictionary's) differ from the one Fox uses.

Does Fox report news, only report something which suits a political agenda or just make it up? Doesn't a news channel have a responsibility which outweighs political ideas.

Re: The Coronavirus Topic

Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 1:19 am
by Lumpy Burgertushie
fox used to be better, but ever since the boys took over from the old man, it has gone down hill in a lot of ways.

lately it is no more reliable for reporting facts than the other main stream media outlets.

they all seem to have TDS.


robert

Re: The Coronavirus Topic

Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:02 am
by John connor
@warmweer Sounds like you know everything. Perhaps you should become president of the U.S.. But good luck with that... :lol: :twisted: :lol:

Edit-

After watching the video, it's clear the truth hurts, doesn't? The guests correctly point out the real situation going on and how the mainstream media like CNN are pushing BS as usual. Correctly pointed out was how the virus was attenuating.

Re: The Coronavirus Topic

Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 6:57 am
by warmweer
John connor wrote:
Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:02 am
@warmweer Sounds like you know everything. Perhaps you should become president of the U.S.. But good luck with that... :lol: :twisted: :lol:
Really? That's all you can come up with?
John connor wrote:
Wed Jun 24, 2020 4:02 am
After watching the video, it's clear the truth hurts, doesn't? The guests correctly point out the real situation going on and how the mainstream media like CNN are pushing BS as usual. Correctly pointed out was how the virus was attenuating.
Attenuating? 36,015 registered new cases in 1 day, almost 1000 new deaths.
You do know the mask is not supposed to cover your eyes and ears, don't you?

Re: The Coronavirus Topic

Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 8:47 am
by John connor
warmweer wrote:
Wed Jun 24, 2020 6:57 am
Attenuating? 36,015 registered new cases in 1 day, almost 1000 new deaths.
And those numbers are from where? Also, do they represent a state, a county a country? What?

The guests did say that the virus was "attenuating" as to suggest that perhaps the virus has mutated in a way so that it can survive but at the present time is now weaker and combine that with heard immunity that seems likely of what is going on.

Now just yesterday I looked at the world COVID-19 numbers and I can't remember what percentage of deaths I came up with now versus those that had COVID-19, but I think it was some 12% if that world-freaking-wide! Now correct me if I'm wrong (which I'm sure you'll do), that seems on par with influenza. Now here politicians and what not are telling us all we need to rot in our house, lose our income and jobs, destroy one's business that took decades to create all because of this Captain Trips. While this virus poses a danger to the public, is no more deadly than the aforementioned influenza, albeit just damn more contagious. Now here in the 50s there was something called polio which was a hell of a lot more severe and in a matter of a couple years they pretty much eradicated it. During that time public pools and what not were off limits, but people were not instructed to stay inside and rot, governors telling you that you can't buy garden seeds or mow your own lawn and other draconian BS.

The media and social media has blown this thing waaaaaay out of proportion and with an election coming up it suits the viewership to run with numbers and what have you to fulfill their BS narrative. Exhibit A is the fact everyone and their great uncle went out and bought toilet paper in mass due to the enclave we now have of media BS. It's in your face 24/7 from the TV, to smart device and Internet. And this is exactly what happened when Venezuela slowly imploded. Everyone first started to buy up toilet paper.



On the subject of toilet paper. A couple of weeks ago the house across the street was severely toilet papered by some adolescents. Because of that the house went on the auction block and on Zillow it's now going for 12.5 million. :lol: :P



Edit-
Really? That's all you can come up with?
Am I suppose to make a massive counter argument with what little drivel I read? Instead, I made the hard hitting point (at least in my opinion) that what you think you know you don't know, and you're not holier than thou let alone run a country or a small town as it relates to the constant and annoying BS about Trump. We get it, YOU DON'T LIKE HIM. Stop making everyone else suffer at the hands of your keyboard illogical gravitas.



Edit-2

Here's some numbers that the media won't EVER report on.

According to WHO, every year in the world there are an estimated 40-50 million abortions. This corresponds to approximately 125,000 abortions per day.
https://www.worldometers.info/abortions/

And that's just abortions! Never mind drugs and alcohol and downright poverty FFS.

Numbers serve two purposes: To fulfill an agenda or to make money. Remember that. Here, I give you the answer in code and let your noggin figure it out. ZNEXRGVAT.

Re: The Coronavirus Topic

Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 8:56 am
by david63
John connor wrote:
Wed Jun 24, 2020 8:47 am
is no more deadly than the aforementioned influenza
Whilst there is some validity in that statement the difference is that there are treatments and vaccines for influenza which go some way towards mitigating the problems. Until such time treatments/vaccines are available for Covid-19 then it remains a serious threat to life.