BEWARE!! OAP drivers licence renewal scam UK

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Mick
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Re: BEWARE!! OAP drivers licence renewal scam UK

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Re: BEWARE!! OAP drivers licence renewal scam UK

Post by AmigoJack »

Mick wrote: Fri Jun 25, 2021 1:43 pmI got the reminder and the forms for my 70 year olds driving licence and started to do it online
Who reminded you of what? Who gave you "the forms" and in which format? How did everything led to doing it online, and who was linking to the website?
Mick wrote: Fri Jun 25, 2021 1:43 pmI went to the proper GOV.UK site manually rather than using the search bar
How do you know the "proper" website? And why now and not right away? Why even using a "search bar" when knowing the address?
Mick wrote: Fri Jun 25, 2021 1:43 pmwhy are these sites allowed to exist it must be easy to shut them down?
For the same reason people can disguise as others, i.e. optically (to trick you into recognizing a known face/clothing style), psychologically (an unknown grandchild you surely want to help), acustically (playing back audio on intercom to impersonate someone)... This all exists and is practiced, but deception alone is not a crime.
Mick wrote: Fri Jun 25, 2021 2:36 pmwhen you type in “GOV.UK renew 70 year olds licence” and get to a site that is, in actual fact, better than the real thing and looks very legit
But you can't tell me you easily fall for how something looks. And moreover judging legality from optics alone. How a website is supposed to identify as legal is beyond my imagination - and until then I rather ask at some bureau for the address or fill out forms by post.

But I halfway understand what you mean: the older you get the more things change and you're just fed up learning it anew again and again, seeing little to no improvement on all the changes. Scamming elderly people seems to be lucrative, because there's little to invest/work for and then just wait for the money to come in. You "just" have to team up with someone who can stack away the money quickly so neither victims nor the police is able to secure or even trace it.
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Re: BEWARE!! OAP drivers licence renewal scam UK

Post by thecoalman »

AmigoJack wrote: Tue Jul 06, 2021 1:32 am
But I halfway understand what you mean: the older you get the more things change and you're just fed up learning it anew again and again, seeing little to no improvement on all the changes. Scamming elderly people seems to be lucrative, because there's little to invest/work for and then just wait for the money to come in.
I once watched my Mother type example.com into a search engine, I gave up trying to explain the difference between the address bar and a search engine let alone trying to explain how to identify the domain using the TLD.

To be fair the nuances of web technologies and technologies is general are lost on a lot of people. They just expect it to work and frankly I don't blame them. You shouldn't have to know how to solder a copper pipe to take a shower. Often times they are being asked to learn a skill they shouldn't need to learn.
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Re: BEWARE!! OAP drivers licence renewal scam UK

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AmigoJack wrote: Tue Jul 06, 2021 1:32 amWho reminded you of what? Who gave you "the forms" and in which format? How did everything led to doing it online, and who was linking to the website?
The reminder and the forms (printed) and information came from the DVLA via the postal service as normal. There are two options to either fill in the forms and post them back or to do it online.
AmigoJack wrote: Tue Jul 06, 2021 1:32 amHow do you know the "proper" website? And why now and not right away? Why even using a "search bar" when knowing the address?
That’s part of the point, in the documentation you are given the correct address and it warns you that the service is free and if, at any point, you’re asked for a payment to leave the site. It was only then I looked at the url I was on and saw the bogus address. It was at this point I bailed.

It’s obvious the DVLA know about the scam and are warning you not to pay and leave the site.

In the first place I typed in the Google address bar:
  1. DVLA dr (no need for more) - a list appeared which included “driving licence renewal” which I clicked on.
  2. The very first hit after that was “Apply online - renew over 70 years old” which I clicked on.
  3. The bogus site came up and I started to fill in the required details.
Note that using the address bar as above the correct .GOV.UK is fifth in the search list which makes me wonder how much the bogus site has paid for it’s ranking.

In the Google address bar I typed the address given in the documentation in full by hand and I got to the correct place that had .GOV.UK in the address.
Mick wrote: Fri Jun 25, 2021 1:43 pmwhy are these sites allowed to exist it must be easy to shut them down?
AmigoJack wrote: Tue Jul 06, 2021 1:32 amFor the same reason people can disguise as others
Indeed and I was fortunate enough, even though I partially fell for it, to come away unscathed.
AmigoJack wrote: Tue Jul 06, 2021 1:32 amdeception alone is not a crime
No but impersonating a government body is in the UK.
Mick wrote: Fri Jun 25, 2021 2:36 pmwhen you type in “GOV.UK renew 70 year olds licence” and get to a site that is, in actual fact, better than the real thing and looks very legit
AmigoJack wrote: Tue Jul 06, 2021 1:32 amBut you can't tell me you easily fall for how something looks. And moreover judging legality from optics alone. How a website is supposed to identify as legal is beyond my imagination - and until then I rather ask at some bureau for the address or fill out forms by post
I agree but there it is, as I said, I nearly fell for it and I consider myself webwise enough not to fall for such things and fortunately I didn’t. I did say if there’s any doubt use the postal forms even though they can be daunting at times. There are lots of folks out there falling for it daily and not just the elderly and not just in the UK. As far as I can tell and have read since there’s nothing malicious about the site, it’s not trying to swipe grannies pension, it’s acting as an intermediary and charging you £80 for a normally free service, you still get your new driving licence.

Hopefully the more this is discussed (I don’t use social media so I can’t comment if it’s being talked about there but I expect it is) the more hindsight will be generated and the perpetrators will get theirs eventually.
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Re: BEWARE!! OAP drivers licence renewal scam UK

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AmigoJack wrote: Tue Jul 06, 2021 1:32 am How do you know the "proper" website? And why now and not right away? Why even using a "search bar" when knowing the address?
I see people do it all the time, old, young, tech savvy and not. Type "CNN" into the Chrome bar, press return, click the first result (almost always an ad) on Google. It seems obvious that it takes more time to let Google's result load and pick up the mouse than it is to type ".com" and press enter.

But you're probably clicking on an ad, so it benefits Google to make this workflow seem normal.
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Re: BEWARE!! OAP drivers licence renewal scam UK

Post by «THÖMÅS®©» »

SpIdErPiGgY wrote: Fri Jun 25, 2021 2:26 pm Read the footer:

Image
I am sure that these are the same scammers that tried to con me out of $99USD when I renewed my ESTA to travel to the United States in 2019. A similar scam that targets the elderly amongst our population.

Spotted it just in time. I went through the official DHS website run by the Government of the United States, not some third party site that extort as much money as possible from people that dont know what is going on all the time.

I dont know how they get away with it. A "Third party processing agency" that does absolutely nothing. They check nothing, they take your money then run.
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Re: BEWARE!! OAP drivers licence renewal scam UK

Post by thecoalman »

They are doing something. The fact you can easily do what they are doing for yourself doesn't make something illegal.

Here in Pennsylvania if I want a plate for a car I can go to just about any used car dealer and other places to get one. Within 1 or 2 miles of where I live there might be 10 different places that provide this service. They charge a private fee for that, I'm not required to go to them but it's convenient if I don't want to make a long trip to the zoo (AKA The DMV) and wait in lines for hours. It's not quite the same because their services have some value but I'm not sure how you would define the value of a service.
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Re: BEWARE!! OAP drivers licence renewal scam UK

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Scams and attempted scams on older people are going on everywhere, not just as reported with the drivers licence thing. Only yesterday I read this about pension cryptocurrency scams. In this case I don’t have very much sympathy for the victim, greed drove him to do what he did. The banks have been warning about these scams for a long time, my bank has a permanent banner on its site warning of such things and has a free advice service you can use if you’re considering investing your pension.

My advice to anyone planning their pension whatever your age is to get a good reliable IFA. They cost nothing during the planning stage (mine didn’t anyway) for example before you retire and very little once the pension is active. As soon as you start paying in to a pension scheme get an IFA - simple.
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Re: BEWARE!! OAP drivers licence renewal scam UK

Post by david63 »

Another one in the news today - there is no limit to how low these scum will go
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Re: BEWARE!! OAP drivers licence renewal scam UK

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Blimey, as you say, scumbags. This is another one where checking the actual senders email address would have shown it up for what it was. The email would have gone in to my junk pile anyway, don’t reply to mail in junk unless you 100% know where it’s come from and even then doubt it.

I regularly get iMsg texts from DSD saying they’re sorry to have missed me and can I go to so and so site and redirect whatever it is they’re on about, presumably they’re after my bank details I’m not sure I’ve never been there. I have never personally used DSD. This usually happens whenever I’ve had a delivery from Amazon or Argos who don’t use DSD. Also, I don’t use iMsg very often, normally I use WhatsApp, so I’m pretty certain if it’s not from my dentist, doctor or mobile phone service provider it’s a scam.
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Re: BEWARE!! OAP drivers licence renewal scam UK

Post by thecoalman »

Slightly off topic but I cam across a Youtube video for excellent way to deal with phone scammers. Answer yes to everything. :D

I've only had the chance to get one person with it but the conversation went something like this:

Scammer: "Hello sir, we are offering low cost car insurance."
Me: "Yes"
Scammer:"Do you currently have a car?"
Me: "Yes"
Scammer: "Can you please give me your license number so we can begin the process?"
Me: "Yes"(I can hear the excitement building in their voice as they think they have a live one)
Scammer: "Excellent, what's the number?"
Me: "Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeesssssssss!"

It was a little more lengthy than that and I did learn a few Indian expletives. :D
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Re: BEWARE!! OAP drivers licence renewal scam UK

Post by AmigoJack »

thecoalman wrote: Mon Aug 02, 2021 12:01 pmphone scammers. Answer yes to everything.
Manipulating audio has become easy nowadays, and for inserting your "yes" at a place where scammers want you to agree to a contract they only need it once, unbound to where you said it.

So I would strongly advise against saying "yes" at all, especially multiple times. If the incoming number is unknown, start the call with "hello" without revealing your name - let them tell you who they think you are (and then come up as someone completely else who just picked up the ringing phone).
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Re: BEWARE!! OAP drivers licence renewal scam UK

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AmigoJack wrote: Mon Aug 02, 2021 12:37 pm Manipulating audio has become easy nowadays, and for inserting your "yes" at a place where scammers want you to agree to a contract they only need it once, unbound to where you said it.
I don't know about where you live Amigo Jack but if someone wants to enforce a contract where I live they are going need a little more than a phone audio recording with me saying yes. The volume of robo/scam calls are so bad in the US legitimate business rarely use the phone and none of them are going to call you unless they have already done business with you. Otherwise they would be breaking the law themselves. A US business cannot cold call you in the US, of course scammers outside of the reach of US law can. Lastly if we were to suppose this was an actual business they may be required to inform you that you are being recorded, this varies by US state.

There is other things I can point out here but the bottom line is I have absolutely no concern about being held to some contract for repeatedly saying the word yes on a phone.
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Re: BEWARE!! OAP drivers licence renewal scam UK

Post by stevemaury »

Mick, have you considered that the same advanced age which makes you susceptible to scams may be telling you that you are too old to drive? No reason to not sit on your rocker with your shawl and order take out. Amazon can take care of your other needs, like elder hygiene products.
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Re: BEWARE!! OAP drivers licence renewal scam UK

Post by Mick »

There’s a very good possibility but I reckon if they can no longer scam my drivers licence replacement fee they’ll conjure up something else to try and relieve me of my pension. Amazon and food deliveries are already engaged and I have been looking in to rocking chairs and clay pipes for some time.
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    " - Harmony Cobel
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