Windows Vista vs Mac OS X

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Crispie
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Post by Crispie »

Yawner wrote: Its interesting that nobody has mentioned Linux thus far.. With the inroads Ubuntu has been making why hasnt Edgy Eft been included within this comparison? I know its still in planning but with the featurelist it looks like the first Linux Distro is a long time that will really have a viable chance against the Paid OS Market..

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Post by Blue_Wolf »

I've got two computer one Windows and Linux the other Mac OS X.

I'm new to Mac (not windows) and it's soo much easier to use than windows and linux!

It has a great GUI as well.
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Post by asia-team »

Since Mac use new Intel CPU already.Why not also combine OSX and Vista? Just idea.
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Post by Vic D'Elfant »

Blue_Wolf wrote: I'm new to Mac (not windows) and it's soo much easier to use than windows and linux!

I also think that this depends on the intended audience. From what I've seen so far, Macs are often being bought by people who are new to the world of computers and need something simple. I'm not saying that a Mac is a toy or something, but it still gives me that impression.

I'm a Windows user myself but I won't be even having a look at a Mac as long as 99% of the software I use doesn't work on it. Yes, this is a slightly stupid way to look at an OS, but I need a productive environment and I really need the applications I use (or very similar applications). Also, the software I develop is made for Windows systems - yet another reason (for me) not to switch to a Mac purely because that would require me to keep a dual-boot system so I can test my applications.

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Post by Erisar »

Vic D'Elfant wrote: I also think that this depends on the intended audience. From what I've seen so far, Macs are often being bought by people who are new to the world of computers and need something simple. I'm not saying that a Mac is a toy or something, but it still gives me that impression.

I'm a Windows user myself but I won't be even having a look at a Mac as long as 99% of the software I use doesn't work on it. Yes, this is a slightly stupid way to look at an OS, but I need a productive environment and I really need the applications I use (or very similar applications). Also, the software I develop is made for Windows systems - yet another reason (for me) not to switch to a Mac purely because that would require me to keep a dual-boot system so I can test my applications.

Vic


Macs are also used heavily in media-related arenas (film editing, music composition/editing, graphic design, etc) for various reasons. They are also becoming increasingly popular for students (higher education or otherwise).

I find it very (very :P) hard to imagine 99% of the applications you use cannot be found for OS X. I converted my primary PC (very hesitantly mind you) to Mac a few years ago, and to date there is literally maybe one or two applications that I miss from my Windows system. Just out of curiosity, what applications are you referring to?

I do of course agree though that if you are used to a Windows environment and develop Windows-based things, then naturally Windows is a better choice for you. I really dislike the ever-present attitude among many Mac users that Mac is the best computing solution ever and that anyone who uses Windows is lame :D. Just like with pretty much everything else in life, choose what you like best and what works for you.

In terms of which operating system will reign as the speediest and most powerful, I suppose we'll have to wait for Vista to come out of RC and then make a reasonable comparison. In terms of which system is more innovative, I think no one can deny that one goes to OS X (particularly in recent releases).
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Post by Vic D'Elfant »

True, I'm sure Mac will have its advantages as well (otherwise, like you said, media-related arenas wouldn't be using it), but it a Mac gives me a feeling like... I'm working on a limited environment. I don't know, it's kinda hard to explain :P

Here's a list of the applications I use and (afaik) are no proper Mac alternatives for:
  • PHPEdit
  • Visual DialogScript and its extensions (pretty simple scripting language, but ideal for small tools)
  • SQLYog
  • Microsoft Visual Studio 2005
  • PowerGREP
  • Acronis True Image
  • ... and of course all the fancy things I made myself ^_^
But of course, no matter what one will say, I'm bound to Windows because of the programming work I do.

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Re: Windows Vista vs Mac OS X

Post by handy1 »

MarkTheDaemon wrote: Did you say "boots up fast on any computer". Since when did Mac OSX start running on PC boxes? Do you know more than the rest of us?


Mark

You now can easily hack OSX to run natively on any x86 machine. Here is a little article that has links showing how to accomplish this. Of course this goes against the OSX end user agreement, because Apple doesn't want you running OSX on a Dell...yet!

Just to give my 2 cents...
I switched to a Mac for my main computer about 5 years ago, and have never looked back. In fact, it was purely by mistake! My wife bought me a iBook for Christmas, because it was cute! She had no idea it has a different OS, and that it wasn't like the Windows boxs that I've owned in the past. I didn't open the box at all, because I was certainly going to return it...until I went to the Apple store and played around with the display model for an hour. I was sold!

I still use Windows at work occationally, but I don't ever see going back to Windows for personal computing...Apple always stays a step ahead of MS (except for marketing). This has been proven over decades of computing.

These are the main reasons I prefer OSX to any Windows OS:
  • Viruses and Spyware - don't even have to think about it.
  • Works out of the Box - Has almost every app you would need for personal computing out of the box. I travel a lot (Airline Pilot), and my laptop plugs into any scanner, printer, etc. that any hotel may have, and just works!
  • Stability - in 5 years it's never crashed
  • and Spotlight! - this makes the cost of a Apple machine worth every penny, and even though the Mac GUI is sweet, Spotlight makes a windows-base UI an endangered species.
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Post by Erisar »

Vic D'Elfant wrote:
  • PHPEdit
  • Visual DialogScript and its extensions (pretty simple scripting language, but ideal for small tools)
  • SQLYog
  • Microsoft Visual Studio 2005
  • PowerGREP
  • Acronis True Image
  • ... and of course all the fancy things I made myself ^_^

TextMate is pretty comparable to PHPEdit, among others. There are some powerful MySQL managers out there for OS X, even something like MySQL Administrator. OS X is Unix based, so GREP functions can be accessed by the command line. For system backup and imaging, you can use a solution like Roxio's Toast, and/or OS X's upcoming Time Machine feature that will introduce, in my opinion, a very cool way to approach backing up one's computer. The others you list are generally associated with Windows development, so of course you'll want to use them on a Windows machine. :D

A nice thing about Macs is that because they are becoming gradually more popular, more people are developing software for it, and more mainstream software companies are releasing OS X versions of their software. Just take a look at a site like VersionTracker and you can see there are thousands of OS X applications out there. Anywho, my point is just that 99% that you mentioned is probably not such an accurate figure, and is sort of a myth about Macs (one that I even believed myself a few years ago). ;)

Like you said, Macs do have advantages, just as Windows systems have theirs. I do know what you mean by Macs coming across as limiting, and I think that's more or less intentional on Apple's part; they seem to like to make things simple (though sometimes to their own detriment). Generally, I think the simplicity of the system is slightly exaggerated though.
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Re: Windows Vista vs Mac OS X

Post by Anon »

handy1 wrote:
MarkTheDaemon wrote: Did you say "boots up fast on any computer". Since when did Mac OSX start running on PC boxes? Do you know more than the rest of us?


Mark

You now can easily hack OSX to run natively on any x86 machine. Here is a little article that has links showing how to accomplish this. Of course this goes against the OSX end user agreement, because Apple doesn't want you running OSX on a Dell...yet!


Still not running by normal standards. Those are that it's allowed, supported and does it properly. It's not allowed under the license, apple won't support it, and the lack of drivers should be enough to put you off ;)

At any rate, the only thing that's putting me off is the price. Yes, the general availability of a mac in general is greater due to the lower cost now, but it still has not come down enough to be widespread.

One example is the budget end. I was buying a laptop for my mother a month ago, and was looking at the cheap end. The really cheap end. I found a Lenovo laptop, which cost $1300 (IIRC), for the laptop and Works Suite 8. The cheapest from apple is a $2300 laptop, and $300 office suite. Remembering of course that all this will do is Word processing, interwebnet and email, she literally did want the cheap. Turns out that the Lenovo is a really good quality laptop [build wise] too, so all good

Another is for the middle end of the market. I was looking for a laptop for me last year. I was looking for something cheap, but was able to do occasional gaming. This ment that anything with Intel GMA graphics was out of the question. I finally settled on a MSI laptop, for $2200, included 1.6ghz celeron M, nvidia 6600, et cetera. And it's fine for doing all that I want.
However if I was to buy a laptop with these criteria in mind, 9 months down the track, I'd have to get a $4100 Macbook pro. Sure, I could settle for the cheap $2300 Macbook, but it'd not suit my needs.

People are hassling Microsoft for being monopolistic and overpriced, whereas if you look at apple they're no better
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Post by SAK ` »

Not even a discount would lower the price of a $4K laptop, especially if it was bundled with business or design suites.

$.@.K.
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Re: Windows Vista vs Mac OS X

Post by handy1 »

Anon wrote: At any rate, the only thing that's putting me off is the price. Yes, the general availability of a mac in general is greater due to the lower cost now, but it still has not come down enough to be widespread.

One example is the budget end. I was buying a laptop for my mother a month ago, and was looking at the cheap end. The really cheap end. I found a Lenovo laptop, which cost $1300 (IIRC), for the laptop and Works Suite 8. The cheapest from apple is a $2300 laptop, and $300 office suite. Remembering of course that all this will do is Word processing, interwebnet and email, she literally did want the cheap. Turns out that the Lenovo is a really good quality laptop [build wise] too, so all good

Another is for the middle end of the market. I was looking for a laptop for me last year. I was looking for something cheap, but was able to do occasional gaming. This ment that anything with Intel GMA graphics was out of the question. I finally settled on a MSI laptop, for $2200, included 1.6ghz celeron M, nvidia 6600, et cetera. And it's fine for doing all that I want.
However if I was to buy a laptop with these criteria in mind, 9 months down the track, I'd have to get a $4100 Macbook pro. Sure, I could settle for the cheap $2300 Macbook, but it'd not suit my needs.

People are hassling Microsoft for being monopolistic and overpriced, whereas if you look at apple they're no better

Touche' (no pun intended, see this video to get the joke!)

Macs are expensive! Though it's personal economics; everything has an opportunity cost. With a Mac, your loosing money you can spend on something else. With a PC, your not loosing as much money, but your loosing time and patience when dealing with viruses, spyware, and instability. It's all a personal choice, and thank God that we live in a free society where we can make said choice!

To each, his own! :D
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Re: Windows Vista vs Mac OS X

Post by Anon »

handy1 wrote: With a PC, your not loosing as much money, but your loosing time and patience when dealing with viruses, spyware, and instability.


Not really anymore, as all of them are easily preventable or not applicable. There are free antivirus programs out there (AVG, Avast, Clamwin anyone?), the 3 common antispyware programs are free (Windows defender, Ad-Aware and Spybot), and instability is almost non existant with the move for consumer level OSes to the NT core. It always astounds me how many people see this as a valid argument, it works about as well as "Macs have absolutlely no games for them" :?
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Post by smithy_dll »

Getting a virus is also user error and stupidity. Most viruses trick people into installing them. Here it's not necessarily anti-virus software you need, it's to educate computer users about the dangerous of running unstrusted files.

Mac OSX itself is not invunerable, and never will be. If it's connected to the internet, it's potentially vunerable.

As for stability, generally that's a hardware issue when talking about the NT kernel, something apple have alot more control over (hardware their OS runs on). Most hardware instability issues are incurred when people install hardware that doesn't have Microsoft Digitally Signed Drivers for it.
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Re: Windows Vista vs Mac OS X

Post by handy1 »

Anon wrote: There are free antivirus programs out there (AVG, Avast, Clamwin anyone?), the 3 common antispyware programs are free (Windows defender, Ad-Aware and Spybot)


OK?...Your not wasting time dealing with this than? To me, having to install, update, and manage these programs IS a waste of time. Additionally, some consumers don't have the technological know-how to effectively deal with this crap. I have been to my father-in-law's on at least two occations to do clean install becuase of problems with viruses and/or spyware. He should have got a Mac! :P [/b]
smithy_dll wrote: Most hardware instability issues are incurred when people install hardware that doesn't have Microsoft Digitally Signed Drivers for it.


Oh...I see! But I thought it was the Mac that had compatability problems! :wink:

BTW, have you guys ever used Mac OS X? Because, without regard for price, if one puts the OSs side-by-side, OS X is cleary better! Though with that said, you still have price to consider! There will be those 3% that drive the Mercedes, and other will just buy Fords...again, it's economics and personal choice.
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Re: Windows Vista vs Mac OS X

Post by Marshalrusty »

handy1 wrote: OK?...Your not wasting time dealing with this than? To me, having to install, update, and manage these programs IS a waste of time. Additionally, some consumers don't have the technological know-how to effectively deal with this crap. I have been to my father-in-law's on at least two occations to do clean install becuase of problems with viruses and/or spyware. He should have got a Mac! :P

So the real advantage of using a Mac is that it's more idiot-proof. Most stability issues with PCs result from people who don't know how to use their computer.

[sidebar]The same thing can be seen with card. The majority of people (myself included) have cars with automatic transmission (especially in the US). This is so, even though manual cars get better mileage, are more durable and generally have greater horsepower.[/sidebar]

You can claim that Macs have great security for now, but as they get more popular, they will also be targetted more. You think that there are fewer viruses for Macs because all that nonexistent antivirus software is better? And now, many Mac users are actually installing Windows to use programs that OSX simply does not have/support.

I paid $1500 for my laptop ($367 of which was the 4 year warranty). I would have had to pay $2500 for an equally capable Mac with a worse warranty.
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