Your Opinion on Vista?

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beatme101
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Re: Your Opinion on Vista?

Post by beatme101 » Wed Sep 05, 2007 6:48 pm

AdamR wrote:
A_O_C wrote:doesnt microsoft have to certify drivers and applications?
In order to get the "Certified for Windows Vista" logo, yes, they do. Or rather, third party developers and testers which Microsoft has contracted do this.

That still doesn't explain the lack of drivers or the fact that very view were even in development in the first place by manufactures. Not being certified for Vista doesn't stop developers from releasing their drivers and applications.

Actually, it does explain it, and not being certified (signed) does stop developers from releasing their drivers for Vista. You see, Windows Vista cannot use a driver that is not digitally signed by Microsoft. That will effectively change alot of freeware (UltraVNC anyone?) to paid software, or they will simply not support Vista. It will also cause alot of hardware (TV tuners anyone?) to cost more money. This is all because now the makers of the drivers HAVE to pay Microsoft to sign their driver.

On Windows XP this was already pretty bad, making the user have to click a prompt to accept a driver.

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Re: Your Opinion on Vista?

Post by AdamR » Thu Sep 06, 2007 2:34 am

beatme101 wrote:Actually, it does explain it, and not being certified (signed) does stop developers from releasing their drivers for Vista. You see, Windows Vista cannot use a driver that is not digitally signed by Microsoft. That will effectively change alot of freeware (UltraVNC anyone?) to paid software, or they will simply not support Vista. It will also cause alot of hardware (TV tuners anyone?) to cost more money. This is all because now the makers of the drivers HAVE to pay Microsoft to sign their driver.

On Windows XP this was already pretty bad, making the user have to click a prompt to accept a driver.
It doesn't stop anyone from installing it anyway, thus it doesn't stop anyone from releasing their products. I have several unsigned drivers and applications running at the moment. All the user has to do is approve the installation. And to be perfectly honest, I've used Vista since launch and I've not had a single driver issue. Maybe I'm just lucky...though I know many people who have had the same experience as me.

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Re: Your Opinion on Vista?

Post by Roberdin » Thu Sep 06, 2007 3:16 pm

Vista x64 will not allow unsigned drivers to be installed, as far as I know. Perhaps this can be turned off, like it can in the 32 bit stream. (On 32 bit, presently there are three options: no unsigned drivers, install following user permission, and just install. It defaults to the middle option, but maybe on x64 it defaults to no unsigned driver installations.) Microsoft is taking advantage of the gradual switch to 64 bit computing to enforce numerous security and stability policies that it could not do in 32 bit for fear of disabling legacy applications.

Except for the effect upon free software, this is an excellent idea. Poor drivers are the number one cause of system crashes. I've been running Vista for a while now and only had one system crash, owing to nVidia. The display driver has in fact crashed a couple of times since, but Windows was able to recover and reboot the driver without restarting the computer, or even the game I was playing. It was rather impressive on their part, though less so on nVidia's.
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Re: Your Opinion on Vista?

Post by cyberken » Tue Sep 11, 2007 11:28 pm

Ive only been using Vista for a short time, granted it took a bit to get used to but I find it much easier, faster and more reliable than XP (in my experience).
Saying that there are a few things I cannot install on it as they will not function correctly and the software team have not or will not provide updates.
But saying that I think the good outweighs the bad 10 times over, I for one am happy I switched over and find it difficult at work now when I use XP or the dredded ME :roll:

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Re: Your Opinion on Vista?

Post by madd74 » Wed Sep 19, 2007 3:48 am

I enjoy Vista... I use it on a weak machine, but that is because this laptop is just barely larger than my phone :D On my Sony Wintel 1.33 solo processor using 1014MB of ram, I am able to get a 2.6 WEI!! Yay for me!! :lol:

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Re: Your Opinion on Vista?

Post by lampstandstudy » Mon Oct 08, 2007 5:08 pm

Just purchased a new PC with Vista Premium. I had heard horror stories on how it is a memory hog so I got a system with 2 gig of RAM. So far, I like it very much.

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Re: Your Opinion on Vista?

Post by bbrian017 » Fri Oct 12, 2007 3:51 pm

I wasn't too sure about Vista at first. The operating system was pretty slow when shutting down and I also had issue with many of my applications at first. I'm now running Vista ultimate with SP1 and I must say the performance difference is outstanding. So if your having issues I suggest you download SP1 and you will notice the difference. One negative issues I have with Vista is the minimum requirement you need to run the darn thing. I mean they should have made it more compatible with older pc or something I have no issues but I know alot of people that would love to run it but just can't and it's not like that have crappy pc's but the system requirements are just too much!

Overall Score I give Vista ultimate SP1

Performance 5/10
Stability 8/10
Compatibility 4/10
Overall Performance 7/10

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Re: Your Opinion on Vista?

Post by AdamR » Sat Oct 13, 2007 5:47 am

bbrian017 wrote:One negative issues I have with Vista is the minimum requirement you need to run the darn thing. I mean they should have made it more compatible with older pc or something I have no issues but I know alot of people that would love to run it but just can't and it's not like that have crappy pc's but the system requirements are just too much!
Vista's requirements are right on par, IMO, with where technology is currently sitting. In order to push technology forward, higher requirements need to be set. I remember when people were mad because Windows 95 required 4MB of RAM.

I'm reminded when OS X fanboys were bashing Vista for it's requirements. Apple turns right around and puts the same requirements on Leopard. I'm not faulting Apple at all. What I'm getting at is that the requirements in order to have new features and improvements need to be increased along with the technology available at the time.

I upgrade certain parts of my PC regardless of whether I need to or not every year just so I can keep up with the times in case I need to run something which is released. Every 4-5 years it gets to the point where parts become incompatible and I start from scratch. That's the cycle of technology and it needs to be factored into the cost of owning a computer, IMO...

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Re: Your Opinion on Vista?

Post by Nicholas the Italian » Sat Oct 13, 2007 9:33 am

AdamR wrote:I upgrade certain parts of my PC regardless of whether I need to or not every year just so I can keep up with the times in case I need to run something which is released. Every 4-5 years it gets to the point where parts become incompatible and I start from scratch. That's the cycle of technology and it needs to be factored into the cost of owning a computer, IMO...
The Industry got you, Adam. :P

I won't say that Windows should run on the same requirements of MS-DOS, of course. Or say stupid jokes like "in 1969 we were able to send men on the moon with a Commodore 64, in 2007 a Pentium 4 1GHz is not able to run Windows solitaire decently". Times do change.
But... the cycle make more powerful hardware => make more demanding software => make more powerful hardware ... is perfectly understandable from the industry point of view; much less from customers' one. Having to change your PC every 2-3 years was ok when it was a geeky thing, but now that it's a common product... is it really needed, or is just the industry pushing it?
(NB: this applies to other products too, of course; mobile phones, for example.)

Windows is an operating system. Operating systems only basic role is to let other applications run on it. I do appreciate that modern OSs have some (a lot of?) additional features to simplify life, and of course some embellishment is not despicable in itself; I do not appreciate when the minimum requirements for an OS to run is a NASA year-2006 computer.
There's no law imposing an OS to use 70% of hardware resources available on average PCs at the time of release. In fact, the OS should use as little as possible.

I'd really like to see, in percentage, where do those 1GB of RAM and 15GB of HD go: kernel? process management? security? error management? backwards compatibility? windows transparency? animated menus? advanced graphics? 3D application switching? embedded useless components? ...
Whatever I say, it's not my fault.

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Re: Your Opinion on Vista?

Post by pickaweb.co.uk » Sat Oct 13, 2007 7:13 pm

Hi,
So far so good.
I really like Vista.

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Re: Your Opinion on Vista?

Post by gesh13 » Sat Oct 13, 2007 11:05 pm

I thing that Vista has very few new things. I just can't think of why the hell the minimum requirements are so much higher than XP.
You must have large amount of RAM if you want it to run normally.
And it still has too many bugs.
Maybe after a year I will install it. I hope a year is enough for the slowpokes from microsoft.
I'm now planning to buy a laptop and even if I buy it with vista, i'll delete it and install XP.
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Re: Your Opinion on Vista?

Post by AdamR » Sun Oct 14, 2007 4:15 am

Nicholas the Italian wrote:But... the cycle make more powerful hardware => make more demanding software => make more powerful hardware ... is perfectly understandable from the industry point of view; much less from customers' one. Having to change your PC every 2-3 years was ok when it was a geeky thing, but now that it's a common product... is it really needed, or is just the industry pushing it?
(NB: this applies to other products too, of course; mobile phones, for example.)
There's also no real reason the "average customer" should upgrade to Vista at this point. I stay on the bleeding edge of technology because I'm a geek. I buy stuff on day one "just because" even though I know in 6 months it'll be half the price.

Again, there's no real reason that the average customer should upgrade to Vista if they computer can't handle it ... heck, maybe not at all and maybe they're perfectly happy with XP. The question is why should those people who do have the computing power (the geeks) or the people who go out and buy a new computer not be able to take advantage of these new features? If the new features and new requirements aren't put somewhere, then they won't ever get rolled out.

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Re: Your Opinion on Vista?

Post by prettybub » Tue Oct 16, 2007 9:13 am

Vista came with my new desktop. I was MAD. I wanted XP. :roll: Only two desktops in stock had it and they were cheap crap. So I went with my buy. Took some getting use to. Im getting use to it. Still miss XP. Hate how it always asks you over and over if your sure you want to do something. BUT Im stuck with it. :roll:
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Re: Your Opinion on Vista?

Post by AdamR » Tue Oct 16, 2007 12:25 pm

prettybub wrote:Hate how it always asks you over and over if your sure you want to do something. BUT Im stuck with it. :roll:
You are aware this can be disabled, right?
User Accounts > Turn User Account Control On or Off

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Re: Your Opinion on Vista?

Post by bbrian017 » Tue Oct 16, 2007 12:48 pm

AdamR wrote:
prettybub wrote:Hate how it always asks you over and over if your sure you want to do something. BUT Im stuck with it. :roll:
You are aware this can be disabled, right?
User Accounts > Turn User Account Control On or Off

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Hey thanks adam I was wondering how to turn this off :)

Thank you

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