New Jersey Bans The Death Penalty

Discussion of non-phpBB related topics with other phpBB.com users.
Forum rules
General Discussion is a bonus forum for discussion of non-phpBB related topics with other phpBB.com users. All site rules apply.
Liquinn
Registered User
Posts: 296
Joined: Sun Nov 12, 2006 1:14 pm

Re: New Jersey Bans The Death Penalty

Post by Liquinn » Wed Jan 02, 2008 8:22 pm

The thing is, in places where the death penality exists, they can ask the inmates to plea guilty, so they get life in prison, so I guess that helps to put someone behind bars, but I guess that's not the point. I think the death penality should be used for murder, and as a last resort.
Going to spain again on the 17th to the 24th of August 2008 after I leave school, so probably won't be around as much during that one week period.

User avatar
Tripp
Former Team Member
Posts: 1358
Joined: Sun May 20, 2007 5:14 am
Location: G'boro, North Carolina
Name: Tripp
Contact:

Re: New Jersey Bans The Death Penalty

Post by Tripp » Wed Jan 02, 2008 9:28 pm

I agree there. By no means did I mean let's use the death penality every chance we get. I, too, would rather see most rot in jail for the rest of their life where they have everyday to think about what they did and probably hate their life. But on the other hand I think that some just need to be taken off this Earth. Gang members who are sent to jail but are still running things and having people killed from the inside need to be put to death. On top of that, it's not like we put them to death in a "inhumane" way. For the US anyway, most cases are lethal injection.
The box said 'You need Windows XP or better' .... so I installed linux.

Formerly Drugs

Liquinn
Registered User
Posts: 296
Joined: Sun Nov 12, 2006 1:14 pm

Re: New Jersey Bans The Death Penalty

Post by Liquinn » Thu Jan 03, 2008 12:31 pm

A good example would be, Dennis Rader, the guy was a bit, odd. Did you see him in court? I watched a program about him, and he explained what he done, like it wasn't even his court case. What am I getting at? At the time of his conviction, Kansas didn't use the death penality, I'm not sure if life or death is best, but he gets to stay alive, when he has no remorse, a good thing he won't be back out.
Going to spain again on the 17th to the 24th of August 2008 after I leave school, so probably won't be around as much during that one week period.

Scizz
Registered User
Posts: 2
Joined: Fri Jan 04, 2008 12:34 pm

Re: New Jersey Bans The Death Penalty

Post by Scizz » Fri Jan 04, 2008 12:38 pm

They had every right to ban it, I wonder what state is next.

The Awesomest Dude
Registered User
Posts: 0
Joined: Sun Dec 09, 2007 4:51 am
Location: Atlanta, GA (temporarily)
Contact:

Re: New Jersey Bans The Death Penalty

Post by The Awesomest Dude » Fri Jan 04, 2008 2:30 pm

First of all I want to say that TY to the OP for posting this because I had no idea this had happened. (I never follow news. I just catch things here and there on the Internet...) And I want to say TY to the NJ Legislature for doing the right thing. It's not everyday that politicians do the right thing. I do hope that other states follow although what I would really like to see is a NATIONAL outlaw of the Death Penalty.

"Why is that?" some may ask. If a person commits a crime, is that not a fair punishment?

The reasons are numerous. Some of the previous posters gave some good ones but I have a few things I could add to the list.

1.) The possibility of Non-Guilt found later. (I know this one was mentioned already but I just wanted to mention it again. :))

2.) It's no better for the Government to do it. Honestly I would rather have regular people murdering than to have the Government doing it. At least most of the regular people know better than to spend $800 on a screwdriver, or leading our country into a war that could have been avoided. ;) (A little off the topic but very relevant and very true.)

3.) Such punishment is unfair to the Defendant.

4.) Like I always say, 2 wrongs don't make nothing right! ;)


Are there cases where Exceptions are appropriate? Of course. Saddam Hussein is a good example. And there are certain other very rare cases of Pre-Meditated Mass Murder and the such that might be also. But those are the exception, not the rule. For the most part it should not even be a option for the Court System to use.

What to do instead? ALL inmates should be REHABILITATED and quickly released as valuable members of society, never to commit another crime. Easier said than done? Yeah. I guess it is but it is what THEY (the ones at the top) are being paid to do. If they cannot accomplish that, perhaps they could use a transfer to the Dept. Of Unemployment? ;) While somebody else is brought in who can get the job done. (Such as myself, strictly for example.)

Right? Is that not 100% fair for EVERYBODY? I think it is. And I've mentioned it on many, many other boards I post on and so far nobody has shown me where I'm wrong. (In fact most people concede as soon as I mention that part.) However, if I am incorrect, somebody please do show me where. I can be wrong, and if I am I do desire to learn.

I think I'm right about this but if I do happen to be wrong (as I have been before), I do desire to know. Needless to say I will admit it, change, thank you (whoever) for the information, and move forward. Furthermore, when I am wrong, I would rather know it than NOT know it. :)
Last edited by stickerboy on Fri Jan 04, 2008 11:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: links removed
I will gladly help anybody with any PhpBB Modifications that I have used. (My board can be accessed by clicking here. You are also welcome to post there any time you like.)
PhpBB helped me when I needed it and I would be glad to give something back to the community.

Scizz
Registered User
Posts: 2
Joined: Fri Jan 04, 2008 12:34 pm

Re: New Jersey Bans The Death Penalty

Post by Scizz » Fri Jan 04, 2008 6:56 pm

Still, a fairly harsh punishment.

User avatar
Jim_UK
Former Team Member
Posts: 18478
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 5:36 pm
Location: Darwen N.West UK

Re: New Jersey Bans The Death Penalty

Post by Jim_UK » Fri Jan 04, 2008 7:15 pm

You are wrong in thinking that all criminals can be rehabilitated.
There are clearly exceptions to this and whilst I would concede that some may be rehabilitated I doubt that is true of the vast number of murderers some of whom lack any morals whatsoever.

I could go on all night typing in examples of ones that you could not rehabilitate but here for example
Charles Manson http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Manson
Peter Sutcliffe http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yorkshire_Ripper

I must object also to your talk of the state murdering the criminals.
Check the definition of murder http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder

Jim
The truth is out there.
Unfortunately they will not let you anywhere near it!

Liquinn
Registered User
Posts: 296
Joined: Sun Nov 12, 2006 1:14 pm

Re: New Jersey Bans The Death Penalty

Post by Liquinn » Fri Jan 04, 2008 8:03 pm

The criminals must regret what they've done, no matter what they've done.
Going to spain again on the 17th to the 24th of August 2008 after I leave school, so probably won't be around as much during that one week period.

User avatar
Techie-Micheal
Security Consultant
Posts: 19511
Joined: Sun Oct 14, 2001 12:11 am
Location: In your servers

Re: New Jersey Bans The Death Penalty

Post by Techie-Micheal » Fri Jan 04, 2008 8:29 pm

Liquinn wrote:The criminals must regret what they've done, no matter what they've done.
Unfortunately you have people that don't. That is why I used the example about drug rehab. Rehab, be it criminal or drug-related will only work if the person being rehabilitated wants it to work. Unfortunately you have people that don't care even want to be in prison. For them, rehab, no matter how much money or how hard everybody else tries, will not work for that person, because they don't want it to work.
Proven Offensive Security Expertise. OSCP - GXPN

The Awesomest Dude
Registered User
Posts: 0
Joined: Sun Dec 09, 2007 4:51 am
Location: Atlanta, GA (temporarily)
Contact:

Re: New Jersey Bans The Death Penalty

Post by The Awesomest Dude » Fri Jan 04, 2008 9:52 pm

Jim_UK wrote:You are wrong in thinking that all criminals can be rehabilitated.
There are clearly exceptions to this and whilst I would concede that some may be rehabilitated I doubt that is true of the vast number of murderers some of whom lack any morals whatsoever.

I could go on all night typing in examples of ones that you could not rehabilitate but here for example
Charles Manson http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Manson
Peter Sutcliffe http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yorkshire_Ripper

I must object also to your talk of the state murdering the criminals.
Check the definition of murder http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder

Jim
Yes, but are you sure that Manson (etc) CANNOT be rehabilitated? Don't get me wrong, it would be easier said than done. But I am almost positive that it COULD be done.

Of course there are certainly some that don't want to change. (Kinda like what another poster was talking about...) What do you do about them? Say "That's enough!" Lock 'em up and throw away the key. If somebody just does not want to change and wants to keep on doing bad things to good people, then forget 'em.

But I think that most of them really do want to change. Keep in mind that as long as the system is like it is, there are going to be "reasons" people commit crimes. (Poeverty, Mental Illness, etc.)

Now don't get me wrong, I am not saying that justifies the person committing the act. Of course not. It takes 2 to tango. Just because wrong was done onto you (them) does not justify doing something wrong to somebody else. That would be 2 wrongs.

What I am really trying to say is that it's not ONLY the Department Of Corrections or the Department Of Justice or any one certain department. It is almost all of them. (I cannot think of a single one that's perfect, or even acceptable. Not one!) There are MANY things that must be fixed.

Of course by the same token, that does not excuse any of them for not doing what they should.

It's very complicated and very complex. Kinda like the issue of Abortion, or even Illegal Immigration, it's very complicated. Of course the Capitol Punishment issue itsself is not that bad, it's just the things that are tied into it. Because almost anybody would agree "if it were possible", except people who are wanting REVENGE. (Which would be a Act Of Anger in itsself, therefore unjustified.) Other than that I think it's safe to say that "if it were possible", almost everybody would be fine with it.

The thing is, if the DOC (etc) were being ran like they should be, about 95 ~ 99 % of all inmates would be rehabilitated, released, and less than 10% would ever commit another crime. They would get degrees from jail, get out and be placed in a job, making 1M/year with the EDUCATION they got. All of the Psychological problems they have (had) would be gone so there wouldn't be no more of that either... And all would be well. :)

The problem is that the DOC is not being ran like that. And like I said, it's complicated. But it WILL be fixed. Why is that?

#1.) More people are learning about it lately. (Largely due to my postings all over the Internet.) Politicians are not going to be able to keep on RIGGING ELECTIONS to get themselfs in office, like they have been doing for about a decade! (And other wrongdoing of that sort...) And:

#2.) Good will always conquor bad in the long-run. (It won't win every battle but it WILL win the war.)

The people who are doing this (including the people who run MANY Corporations and Goverment Agencies which I could name off), they know that what they are doing, and they know full well that it's not right. They think they can get away with it. And they have been! Although it will not last. Good will win out.

And that's the thought I'm gonna leave you with. I appreciate your comments. I had to think. I like that. :) (BTW, I haven't debated the Capitol Punishment much lately. I've done most other issues lately, including Corrections Departments, just not Capitol Punishment. Not in a while anyway...)


EDIT: I removed that link. Sorry about that. I didn't know. I do now. I won't do it again.
Last edited by The Awesomest Dude on Sat Jan 05, 2008 4:20 am, edited 2 times in total.
I will gladly help anybody with any PhpBB Modifications that I have used. (My board can be accessed by clicking here. You are also welcome to post there any time you like.)
PhpBB helped me when I needed it and I would be glad to give something back to the community.

Liquinn
Registered User
Posts: 296
Joined: Sun Nov 12, 2006 1:14 pm

Re: New Jersey Bans The Death Penalty

Post by Liquinn » Fri Jan 04, 2008 10:21 pm

The truth is, some people think the Death Penality is fine, and other don't, the truth is, I beleive it's against Human Rights~
Going to spain again on the 17th to the 24th of August 2008 after I leave school, so probably won't be around as much during that one week period.

User avatar
stickerboy
Former Team Member
Posts: 7349
Joined: Mon Mar 29, 2004 2:27 pm
Location: Airdrie, UK (127.0.0.1)
Name: Kenny Cameron
Contact:

Re: New Jersey Bans The Death Penalty

Post by stickerboy » Fri Jan 04, 2008 11:35 pm

The Awesomest Dude - if you plan on using links, please do not just link to a list of topics, especially from your own site.
Also, this isn't a government bashing topic. Keep on topic please.
I'm a web-designing code-decrypting tech-support musician
|| Twitter || Flickr || phpBB Snippets ||
Formerly known as cherokee red

The Awesomest Dude
Registered User
Posts: 0
Joined: Sun Dec 09, 2007 4:51 am
Location: Atlanta, GA (temporarily)
Contact:

Re: New Jersey Bans The Death Penalty

Post by The Awesomest Dude » Sat Jan 05, 2008 3:12 am

cherokee red wrote:The Awesomest Dude - if you plan on using links, please do not just link to a list of topics, especially from your own site.
Also, this isn't a government bashing topic. Keep on topic please.
Oh I didn't realise that was against the rules. Sorry about that. I won't do it again.

I read the rules (and the GD rules), I guess I should read them again, LOL (Which I WILL do before I post again and I'll try not to do anything else wrong...)

I will link to a specific topic next time. The reason I linked to the board was because it had the different examples of what I was talking about. I thought that was ok. I appreciate you telling me. I won't do that again.

If I happen to do anything else that is against your site's standards, please inform me and I will comply. (And I will read the rules again before I post anything else.) I always try to follow the rules but I'm human. :)
I will gladly help anybody with any PhpBB Modifications that I have used. (My board can be accessed by clicking here. You are also welcome to post there any time you like.)
PhpBB helped me when I needed it and I would be glad to give something back to the community.

Scizz
Registered User
Posts: 2
Joined: Fri Jan 04, 2008 12:34 pm

Re: New Jersey Bans The Death Penalty

Post by Scizz » Sat Jan 05, 2008 3:16 pm

China will ban it, eventually.

Post Reply

Return to “General Discussion”