What's the difference between /en and /en_us?

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Techie-Micheal
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Re: What's the difference between /en and /en_us?

Post by Techie-Micheal » Mon Sep 21, 2009 6:38 pm

arod-1 wrote:
Roberdin wrote:Please spell it out for me, as I am not a mod author I am obviously too stupid to understand without your explanation.

Thank you for your time.
was not trying to hint that anyone is "stupid". if my previous post came out as aggressive or confrontational i do apologize.
as to the actual question:
what would such a change entail?
well, first thing, to the best of my knowledge, the modx syntax does not even contain a "rename directory" verb (required for the upgrade script), so you have your first obstacle right there.
How is MODX required for upgrades?
(also - just think of all those support questions of users asking how to perform the rename using all kinds of ftp clients - command line, gui etc. for the users who choose to do the upgrade manually)
second, the vast majority of MODs contain at least one language string. mods in database are required to support the default - i.e. english language. hence, each and every *existing* mod (except the small minority of mods with no language strings) will have to post a new version, even if nothing in the new phpbb version requires any real change to the mod. this is a very significant load on mod authors as well as validation team, and for a while at least 2 versions of the mod will have to be maintained (one for "language/en" and one for "language/en_gb") if the mod author wish to continue support for older versions of phpbb (say, when a bug in the mod is found and fixed).
And any MODs that have prosilver changes will need to update whenever there is something affecting that.
this might (and might not - someone will have to try!) screw the ability to remove mods that were installed with automod.
AutoMOD, last I checked, isn't final, so nobody should be using it yet for production use.
and lastly, since the language directory is mapped one-to-one to a field in the users table in the db (user_lang or somesuch) it will require actual update to the DB which, among other things, would make all backups taken before the switch unusable (at least for boards that support english).

there might be some more implications - these are what i came up with after two minutes of thought about the subject.
nothing insurmountable, but i wouldn't call it "just adding a language key".

and remind me - what would be the value-added?

peace.
I never said it was just adding a language key, so please do not put words in my mouth.

You have yet to show me how the costs are greater. In my two minutes of thought, not only did I consider those things, but I also considered how they can be overcome.

1. MODX isn't required for upgrades, so that's a moot point.
2. Nobody should be using automod for a production board, so that's a moot point.
3. Backups can be taken beforehand, and the directory rename can be reverted back if a database update fails with a database backup restore performed.
4. The best yet, I stopped trying to make my point a while ago, but you continued. Now, if you wish to insult my intelligence further, you are going to have to do better than that.
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Re: What's the difference between /en and /en_us?

Post by arod-1 » Mon Sep 21, 2009 8:01 pm

this is becoming silly. i am not "making points". you asked a question, i assumed your question was earnest, and i tried to answer. this is not a pissing contest.
Techie-Micheal wrote:I never said it was just adding a language key, so please do not put words in my mouth.
this is true. you said:
Techie-Micheal wrote:The cost should be no more than adding a language key that MOD authors need to add.
and that is what i meant. i apologize if i misquoted you.

my reference to modx (when discussing inability to handle directory rename) was a misspeak.
i meant the automatic upgrade tool. the reason for the mixup was that in the past, upgrade were distributed using the MOD syntax.
i apology for the confusion, but the actual issue still stands: the auto-update tool is not equipped to handle directory rename.

to summarize: if you look away from the trees and examine the forest, it's just illogical to argue that renaming the language/en directory will create negligible amount of work.
if you disagree on this point i suggest we agree to disagree and cordially continue (each) to do whatever it was we were doing before this whole discussion erupted.

the main issue was and remained: there is no beef here. the benefit is zilch.


peace.

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Re: What's the difference between /en and /en_us?

Post by Techie-Micheal » Tue Sep 22, 2009 1:21 am

Benefit? End of confusion.

I don't know why this is continuing, I stopped my argument a while ago. :P
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Re: What's the difference between /en and /en_us?

Post by Marshalrusty » Tue Sep 22, 2009 9:31 am

British English is used in phpBB because Britain is the source of the English language spoken in other countries. Likewise, Spanish originated in Spain and French from France, although both are spoken throughout the world, and more Spanish speakers are in Mexico than Spain. As was also mentioned, phpBB is based in the UK. Since more than half of the team is based somewhere in Europe, en-gb makes the most sense for all these reasons.

I don't see the directory names as a big deal, although it should have been en-gb, in my opinion. The cons of renaming it now, however, far outweigh the benefits.
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Re: What's the difference between /en and /en_us?

Post by Techie-Micheal » Tue Sep 22, 2009 3:47 pm

Why do people keep bringing this up? I've stopped a long time ago, but we keep rehashing the same thing over and over and over and over and over and over and over ... I'm sorry, but I'm more than a little annoyed. We keep going over the same things again and again, even after I've tried more than once to end it. I guess this is my punishment for bringing it up?
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Re: What's the difference between /en and /en_us?

Post by Marshalrusty » Tue Sep 22, 2009 4:16 pm

Sorry Micheal, that wasn't necessarily directed at you. I read through the topic and there were incorrect points made, so I replied.
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Re: What's the difference between /en and /en_us?

Post by Techie-Micheal » Tue Sep 22, 2009 6:16 pm

Marshalrusty wrote:Sorry Micheal, that wasn't necessarily directed at you. I read through the topic and there were incorrect points made, so I replied.
Cheers. :) Sorry for getting upset, I was just getting annoyed since I had tried to stop making my point a while go, but it keeps coming back to haunt me. :P
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