Discuss: phpBB 3.1 discontinues support for PHP < 5.2

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updown
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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.1 discontinues support for PHP < 5.2

Post by updown » Tue Jan 26, 2010 9:41 pm

good decision ;)

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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.1 discontinues support for PHP < 5.2

Post by Fexys » Tue Jan 26, 2010 9:43 pm

I totaly agree this decision ;)

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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.1 discontinues support for PHP < 5.2

Post by Luckyluciano » Tue Jan 26, 2010 11:01 pm

Wise decision, it's time to check the version of PHP you are using, and if necessary to invite the host to do version upgrades.
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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.1 discontinues support for PHP < 5.2

Post by Pony99CA » Wed Jan 27, 2010 12:35 am

EightOhProlene wrote:Can someone explain to me why people seem to think I need to know what version of PHP they are using? I do not care what version PHP is on your server. Discuss the announcement, as requested.
Agreed. If you feel that you must tell the world what version of PHP you're using, there was a poll asking about it last year(although I can't find it now). (Searching Topic Titles for "php version" returns all sorts of topics with PHP in the title, many of which don't have "version" in them. Why would "version" be ignored?)

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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.1 discontinues support for PHP < 5.2

Post by updown » Wed Jan 27, 2010 2:56 am

EightOhProlene wrote:Can someone explain to me why people seem to think I need to know what version of PHP they are using? [...] Discuss the announcement, as requested.
Don't get so hard on them, it's just another way to express that they are happy about the decision ;)

By the way, I also use PHP version 5.2 - just in case somebody is interested in :P


What I'm a little more curious about is this:
naderman wrote:After much internal discussion [...]
Ehhm, what had to be discussed so much about this?

:?:

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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.1 discontinues support for PHP < 5.2

Post by Phil » Wed Jan 27, 2010 3:16 am

updown wrote:Ehhm, what had to be discussed so much about this?
How/when such a requirement would be introduced, for example.
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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.1 discontinues support for PHP < 5.2

Post by updown » Wed Jan 27, 2010 3:25 am

iWisdom wrote:How/when such a requirement would be introduced, for example.
Thanks! Honestly, I asked this for understanding the arguments, not as a razz (if it sounds so). Since there has been "much" discussion, can you or other team members give us some more examples what point of views have been discussed and why it hasn't been an "easy" or "quick" decision (as I would have assumed)?

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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.1 discontinues support for PHP < 5.2

Post by Eelke » Wed Jan 27, 2010 8:09 am

I'd much rather see the developers actually working on the new version than having to explain the decision process. Do we have to analyse all announcements word by word? Sometimes decisions are criticized because people believe they were made too quickly, other times the teams have to explain why they needed "much" discussion. "After much discussion" is another way of saying "we carefully considered this". It also doesn't say anything about the time window in which the discussion took place.

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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.1 discontinues support for PHP < 5.2

Post by ckwalsh » Wed Jan 27, 2010 8:35 am

Eelke wrote:I'd much rather see the developers actually working on the new version than having to explain the decision process. Do we have to analyse all announcements word by word? Sometimes decisions are criticized because people believe they were made too quickly, other times the teams have to explain why they needed "much" discussion. "After much discussion" is another way of saying "we carefully considered this". It also doesn't say anything about the time window in which the discussion took place.
It's fine, questions don't hurt :D

I can't speak for the development team, but off the top of my head I can think of php version distribution, php module support, possibly introducing different kinds of errors/how to support it, backwards compatibility, is there actually anything to gain from requiring a higher php version?

For example, imagine if they had chosen php 6 :P
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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.1 discontinues support for PHP < 5.2

Post by ToonArmy » Wed Jan 27, 2010 8:56 am

updown wrote:Ehhm, what had to be discussed so much about this?
  • Do we drop support in 3.0?
  • Do we wait until 3.2?
  • Do we require 5.3?
  • Do we require 5.2?
  • Do we require 5.1?
  • Do we require 5.0?
  • How do we make the transition?
  • What impact is it going to have?
  • How quickly do we break PHP4 support once the change is made?
  • etc.
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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.1 discontinues support for PHP < 5.2

Post by Highway of Life » Wed Jan 27, 2010 10:09 am

Brainy wrote:I can't speak for the development team, but off the top of my head I can think of php version distribution, php module support, possibly introducing different kinds of errors/how to support it, backwards compatibility, is there actually anything to gain from requiring a higher php version?
PHP 5 functions and classes that don’t exist in earlier versions, no more wrapper needed, the ability to use the PHP 5 object model, abstract classes, interfaces, magic methods, autoload ability, constructors and destructors, class constants, static methods and properties, type hinting, passing objects by reference, new extensions that includes SimpleXML, DOM and XSL extensions, a ton of new hash functions, a bunch of new array functions including combine, diff, udiff, walk, uintersect, better date and time handling, str_split, the awesome new filter extension, JSON Extension, the Zip extension...

Anyway, I could go on and on, but that's a very short summary of what is available in PHP 5.2 that was not available in PHP4, it sure makes a lot less work for developers to only worry about supporting PHP 5.2. :)
updown wrote:Ehhm, what had to be discussed so much about this?
The committee has decided... we want the White Fire Trucks. :)
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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.1 discontinues support for PHP < 5.2

Post by ToonArmy » Wed Jan 27, 2010 1:03 pm

Highway of Life wrote:[...] passing objects by reference [...]
Eh? You can do that in 4.
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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.1 discontinues support for PHP < 5.2

Post by 3Di » Wed Jan 27, 2010 1:51 pm

Eelke wrote:I'd much rather see the developers actually working on the new version than having to explain the decision process. Do we have to analyse all announcements word by word? Sometimes decisions are criticized because people believe they were made too quickly, other times the teams have to explain why they needed "much" discussion. "After much discussion" is another way of saying "we carefully considered this". It also doesn't say anything about the time window in which the discussion took place.
Yup, that's what I thought too, probably because we were used to read announcements made "in a different way, so to speak".. is that a new policy to advert us about "nothing"? My guess is: ofcourse when and if the new phpBB will be released perhaps (history speak books to everyone here) also the PHP version could be obsolete, maybe also 6/6-DEV? Who can say that? :geek:

Do the Dev Team want to know what us we are thinking about.... nothing special? Excuse me if I can seem quite rude, it is not my intention indeed.

What about to let us know/read/test something very special?

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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.1 discontinues support for PHP < 5.2

Post by Kellanved » Wed Jan 27, 2010 2:11 pm

Please, let us all stay reasonable. I don't think that anybody sees any requirement to slow development down by supporting php versions that are no longer receiving security patches from php itself. In the past two years, we were approached several times by people who wanted us to remove php4 support, not even once by people begging us to keep it.

The decision was not made on a whim, as ToonArmy pointed out - we considered all angles and came to a decision that we believe to echo the sentiment of the vast majority of the userbase.
  • 3.1 development is significantly eased by not having to worry about workaround code
  • Overall server security is improved by using supported php versions
  • From 3.0.7 on, users of php4 will receive a warning in the ACP. Considering that 3.0 support will not end this year, there is ample warning
If you believe that php4 support for 3.1 is essential, then your are by all means welcome to submit patches and/or offering MODs to introduce that ;) .
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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.1 discontinues support for PHP < 5.2

Post by Eelke » Wed Jan 27, 2010 4:21 pm

Kellanved wrote: The decision was not made on a whim, as ToonArmy pointed out - we considered all angles and came to a decision that we believe to echo the sentiment of the vast majority of the userbase.
Well, FWIW and as far as I can tell, you were now being "critized" (although that may be to heavy a term) exactly because you carefully considered all angles. :? For me, the decision is fine, it's a good thing that it wasn't made on a whim and I'm looking forward to the cleaner code this will no doubt result in for phpBB 3.1.

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