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Re: SEF/SEO URLs

Posted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 12:18 am
by phpDummie
Callum95 wrote:You don't need SEO urls for that - firefox also searches the page titles
Lumpy Burgertushie wrote:but that has nothing to do with SEO. That has to do with your memory and the memory of your browser.
It depends on what exactly one understands for SEO. It has nothing to do with human-readable URLs, that much is true, but it has to do with browser page title, which I do consider a part of SEO.

Although I do agree that Google has no problem indexing phpBB boards, the story is somewhat different with Yahoo and whatever the engine-of-the-day from Microsoft. The latter generally show considerably lower indexation. It is anybody's guess why, but it may, just may, has something to do with dynamic URLs.

As far as the page titles are concerned, it is time to get rid of 'View forum' and 'View topic' for they have no relevance to the content of the page. Most of the time it is irrelevant to the readers if the information they are looking for comes from a forum. Page titles should not have anything that is not descriptive of the page's content.

And finally, I think this periodic calls for phpBB's URL SEO optimization came mostly from the CMS crowd and are mostly misguided. Having heard from numerous SEO "experts" about the importance of keywords in the URLs, they have a hair-raising experience having looked at phpBB URLs. They do, however, miss a very important issue: while publishing articles on a WordPress or Joomla site they can be in complete control of the titles and can even hand-craft the permalinks, they are not in control of topic titles every Jane and Jack can come up within a forum. Even a moderately active forum can generate hundreds of titles every month making it unmanageable for any meaningful SEO optimization. Yes, they cam still slap a topic number into the URL to prevent duplication of content, which may be a reasonable compromise.

The bottom line is - and I will take the trouble of repeating the previous speakers - when it comes to search engine ranking (and this IS what we are after, isn't it?), the significance of having keywords in the URLis much lesser than having valuable content and back links. Uniqueness of content and back links will affect site ranking way more than keywords in URLs and site ranking is what moves you up the Google's list. Rather than pissing and moaning about not having human-readable URLs, concentrate on having human-readable content.

Re: SEF/SEO URLs

Posted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 1:52 am
by Lumpy Burgertushie
just what I've been saying all along.

nobody cares what the url is. search engines care what content is on the page so that when their customer does a search for certain content, it can give that customer the best results for their search.

we, as board/site owners need to make that as easy as we can for the search engines.

now, having said that, if you are not selling anything on your site or have some other good reason to need a lot of traffick then why do you care how high you are in google or if you are there at all.

if your site is about widgets,and you want a million members to discuss them on your board, then go out there to the other widget sites and post interesting things about widgets and leave a link to your board.

robert

Re: SEF/SEO URLs

Posted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 4:28 pm
by callumacrae
I would disagree with removing "View forum" and "view topic" from the title, as I find them pretty usefull (especially when people have stupid forum / post names). And as to the Bing / Yahoo thing, how many people actually use them? Not that that's a valid excuse, of course.

~Callum

Re: SEF/SEO URLs

Posted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 10:32 pm
by Pony99CA
Callum95 wrote:I would disagree with removing "View forum" and "view topic" from the title, as I find them pretty usefull (especially when people have stupid forum / post names).
How about having the best of both worlds? Make the page titles templates (not templates in the Styles sense, mind you) in the ACP (allowing language file replacements, of course).

Steve

Re: SEF/SEO URLs

Posted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 11:12 pm
by callumacrae
Pony99CA wrote:
Callum95 wrote:I would disagree with removing "View forum" and "view topic" from the title, as I find them pretty usefull (especially when people have stupid forum / post names).
How about having the best of both worlds? Make the page titles templates (not templates in the Styles sense, mind you) in the ACP (allowing language file replacements, of course).

Steve

So you mean taking the ability to make the title away from the style and just having something like {PHPBB_TITLE}?

~Callum

Re: SEF/SEO URLs

Posted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 11:43 pm
by Pony99CA
Callum95 wrote:
Pony99CA wrote:
Callum95 wrote:I would disagree with removing "View forum" and "view topic" from the title, as I find them pretty usefull (especially when people have stupid forum / post names).
How about having the best of both worlds? Make the page titles templates (not templates in the Styles sense, mind you) in the ACP (allowing language file replacements, of course).
So you mean taking the ability to make the title away from the style and just having something like {PHPBB_TITLE}?
Yes, and the ACP would have entries for View Forum Title and View Topic Title. The defaults would be whatever they are today (something like {S_SITENAME} &bul; {L_VIEWFORUM} &bul; {S_FORUM_NAME} for View Forum, although I'm sure the variable names aren't correct).

You could even do something similar for META tag descriptions, which could boost SEO a bit.

Steve

Re: SEF/SEO URLs

Posted: Sat Jan 08, 2011 2:25 am
by lurttinen
Just found out. (Of curiosity)
My site phpBB Suomi (signature link) is pagerank 6 when phpbb.com is 5
AFAIK we both run vanilla with less than few modifications to our forum.
I have a shitload of backlinks from my language pack, but every link back to my site has one link back here.
(Translation info + phpBB stuff)

Re: SEF/SEO URLs

Posted: Sat Jan 08, 2011 2:35 am
by phpDummie
Callum95 wrote:I would disagree with removing "View forum" and "view topic" from the title, as I find them pretty usefull (especially when people have stupid forum / post names).
What I would find useful is some sort of argumentation in support of your point. Just "them pretty usefull" (sic) isn't enough. For the life of me I fail to see the usefulness of "View forum" and "View topic" even with 'stupid forum / post names'.
Callum95 wrote:And as to the Bing / Yahoo thing, how many people actually use them? Not that that's a valid excuse, of course.
I don't need to explain that this is a fallacy, do I? Pretty soon you'll be saying things like "Apple computers are inferior to Wintels because the user base is smaller".

Re: SEF/SEO URLs

Posted: Sat Jan 08, 2011 6:09 am
by Ozo
This has been addressed in area51 and the patch accepted for 3.1.x :)
http://area51.phpbb.com/phpBB/viewtopic ... 84&t=32742

Re: SEF/SEO URLs

Posted: Sat Jan 08, 2011 7:44 am
by Pony99CA
Ozo wrote:This has been addressed in area51 and the patch accepted for 3.1.x :)
http://area51.phpbb.com/phpBB/viewtopic ... 84&t=32742
Before anybody gets too excited, this post is misleading (at best). When I read it, I thought you meant that they'd accepted readable URLs. Nope, they're only talking about "optimized" page titles (and not the ACP templates that I mentioned).

You really should have quoted the post you were referring to. :?

Steve

Re: SEF/SEO URLs

Posted: Sat Jan 08, 2011 8:44 am
by phpDummie
Ozo wrote:This has been addressed...
What's 'this'?

Moving things around and replacing bullets with dashes is hardly 'addressing' anything. It is absolutely pathetic that at this day and age phpbb doesn't have ACP-configurable page titles. This "View forum" and "View page" issue has been brought up many times over the years and the development team's flat out refusal to do anything about it is the best testament of its arrogance and stubbornness. Gee whiz, they only now came around recognizing the necessity for pagination within the title!

Re: SEF/SEO URLs

Posted: Sat Jan 08, 2011 10:14 am
by callumacrae
phpDummie wrote:
Ozo wrote:This has been addressed...
What's 'this'?

Moving things around and replacing bullets with dashes is hardly 'addressing' anything. It is absolutely pathetic that at this day and age phpbb doesn't have ACP-configurable page titles. This "View forum" and "View page" issue has been brought up many times over the years and the development team's flat out refusal to do anything about it is the best testament of its arrogance and stubbornness. Gee whiz, they only now came around recognizing the necessity for pagination within the title!
You'd better of saying that at area51. I don't think many people would actually use it, it is one of those things that should be a modification, as it would just bloat boards that don't need it.

~Callum

Re: SEF/SEO URLs

Posted: Sat Jan 08, 2011 4:34 pm
by Lumpy Burgertushie
I can't speak for the developers here, but if there was any proof that any of this would really help in search engine ranking to any measurable degree, then maybe they might do it.

However, there is none that I have found.

robert

Re: SEF/SEO URLs

Posted: Sat Jan 08, 2011 5:28 pm
by lurttinen
So, phpBB is as good as it possibly can be and there is no need to improve it in the area of SEO?
There is a demand for SEO stuff for phpBB. Are they all selling snake oil? :)

Re: SEF/SEO URLs

Posted: Sat Jan 08, 2011 8:03 pm
by Lumpy Burgertushie
mostly.

many people providing SEO MODs etc. for phpbb have no clue about what SEO is really all about.

and/or they are basing what they know on very old information and/or information that does not apply to
dynamic scripts like phpbb.

Most users really don't have a clue about SEO and how it applies to regular websites, much less to bulletin boards/ php scripts etc.

robert