Discuss: phpBB 3.2.1 released

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mamba
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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.2.1 released

Post by mamba » Fri Aug 18, 2017 1:41 am

DavidIQ wrote:
Fri Aug 18, 2017 1:28 am
And I find it a poor show that you've manually edited files for these changes when no edits are needed.
Oh really? Please show me the extension that puts a slider into the header, or puts unique graphics on the registration page. They do not exist, ergo my own edits were required.
Also suggesting an announcement was needed to state that edits are discouraged is a bit excessive and, frankly, a bit obvious through the introduction of extensions and events for which announcements and discussions were made.
You will find that a lot of people will disagree with this. Anyone who has put edits into their core files, in fact. There must be thousands of people.
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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.2.1 released

Post by david63 » Fri Aug 18, 2017 5:56 am

mamba wrote:
Fri Aug 18, 2017 1:41 am
Please show me the extension that puts a slider into the header, or puts unique graphics on the registration page. They do not exist, ergo my own edits were required.
There is at least one slider extension around - whether it does what you want is another matter.

Without stating the obvious - if you needed to do edits then why not create them as extensions?
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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.2.1 released

Post by John connor » Fri Aug 18, 2017 8:13 am

Mamba, I have made core edits myself. What I did was write down in a notepad on the desktop what the edits were. I just use the manual update now since I discovered 3.2 F&^%S with your board using automatic updates. When I used automatic updates to go from 3.1.10 to 3.2 it destroyed my board. Luckily I make backups.

You may want to pull a copy of your public_html and the update phpBB folder and use Winmerge to see the edits.

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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.2.1 released

Post by Ger » Fri Aug 18, 2017 9:38 am

mamba wrote:
Fri Aug 18, 2017 1:15 am
DavidIQ wrote:
Fri Aug 18, 2017 1:03 am
Yep, but here we are with you complaining you're unable to update due to making likely totally avoidable edits to core files. ;) Also we've been saying to avoid editing them as much as possible for a few years now.
Why have I never seen any official announcement that advises specifically not to make changes to core files? If there is one, it was not made clear to sporadic visitors to this site, like me.
It was made pretty clear on the launch page during the 3.1 days: https://web.archive.org/web/20141125030 ... ut/launch/ (takes some time to load)
Manually editing code is a thing of the past. Quickly installed in the ACP, extensions are to phpBB 3.1 what MODs were to phpBB 2.0 & 3.0. Our huge customisation community is hard at work building new extensions to help you get the most out of your forum.
Seems pretty clear to me?
That has been around for approx. 2 years, before it was changed to highlight the new features for 3.2
Regarding "totally avoidable edits", that's nonsense. All of my edits are key to the functioning of my site, such as:
  • automated slider in header that tells visitors key information
  • Tailored registration process with key statements and graphics
A slider seems like a thing from your style. Styles are generally either completely on their own or inherit from a parent (most likely prosilver). That's been the way since 2008: https://blog.phpbb.com/2008/07/31/templ ... ot-easier/
And it's the recommended way to do it on a dedicated manual page: https://www.phpbb.com/styles/create/

Now I don't know what "key statements and graphics" exactly means on the registration page, but any graphics can easily be added in your style. Any simple texts can also be added there if you have only 1 language available on your board (like mosts boards have).

So yes, most edits to core files could be avoided IMO. And from what you've told us about your edits, they probably could have been avoided since 2008.
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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.2.1 released

Post by WelshPaul » Fri Aug 18, 2017 9:39 am

mamba wrote:
Fri Aug 18, 2017 1:41 am
You will find that a lot of people will disagree with this. Anyone who has put edits into their core files, in fact. There must be thousands of people.
Same here, not worth creating extensions in some cases. Many don't want to learn how to code an entire extension just to implement a single or simple change. Also, creating an extension isn't without issue! Had a few extensions break after phpbb released an update or two. Think 3.1.7 broke about 10 in one go. Extensions can be just as much of a headache as the old mod's used to be.

FYI, I have done the same as John Connor, made a text file that contains all the changes I have made to the core files (not many). Took me 5 minutes to implement those changes into 3.2.1's core files manually. I did come up with an extension that I made for use with 3.1.x that would implement these changes, but that extension broke with the release of 3.2.0! Rather than update it only for it to break again at some point, I decided to manually edit the core files.

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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.2.1 released

Post by mamba » Fri Aug 18, 2017 12:31 pm

Yes, I could make a list of the changes and keep it in a separate document, and insert the edits with each and every update .... but wow, this is a retrograde step when the auto-updates were working so well.

If the auto-update function is broken, the update should have been pulled and the auto-update fixed. That's how a serious software group would have behaved. Instead, it seems like amateur hour.
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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.2.1 released

Post by KevC » Fri Aug 18, 2017 12:41 pm

Why is everything such a drama?

The update was broken. It was taken down to stop breaking other boards. That's fine, it's not the end of the world. There's nothing unsafe about staying on 3.2.0 for the moment and going to 3.2.2 when it comes out using the update package provided. That's it. Done. Stop worrying, enjoy your board as it is, it's not broken, just wait for the next version.

For people who don't have hard coded changes they can update with the full files if they want to or they too can wait for 3.2.2. There would only be a concern and a need to push out a fixed version if there was a security update involved and there isn't, so just forget about it.
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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.2.1 released

Post by P_I » Fri Aug 18, 2017 12:50 pm

KevC wrote:
Fri Aug 18, 2017 12:41 pm
Why is everything such a drama?

The update was broken. It was taken down to stop breaking other boards. That's fine, it's not the end of the world. There's nothing unsafe about staying on 3.2.0 for the moment and going to 3.2.2 when it comes out using the update package provided. That's it. Done. Stop worrying, enjoy your board as it is, it's not broken, just wait for the next version.

For people who don't have hard coded changes they can update with the full files if they want to or they too can wait for 3.2.2. There would only be a concern and a need to push out a fixed version if there was a security update involved and there isn't, so just forget about it.
The 3.2.1 release announcement indicates there were security issues fixed.
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We are pleased to announce the release of phpBB 3.2.1 "War for the Planet of the Berties". This version is a maintenance & security release of the 3.2.x branch which fixes three security issues, as well as adding more hardening and fixes for various bugs reported in previous versions.
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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.2.1 released

Post by WelshPaul » Fri Aug 18, 2017 2:43 pm

Turns out that another extension I use is broken when used with 3.2.1. Extensions were supposed to be easy, trouble free, bla bla bla. :?

On one hand you are told to update, update, update. When something breaks it's oh, more fool you for updating! :roll:

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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.2.1 released

Post by canonknipser » Fri Aug 18, 2017 2:50 pm

If you are able to make changes to the core (and if you know, what you do and do not just follow blindly some instructions), you should also be able to use a file comparison tool between your sources and the 3.2.0 source to identify the differences to copy over in the 3.2.1 source.

It's no magic, just know your tools.
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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.2.1 released

Post by WelshPaul » Fri Aug 18, 2017 2:57 pm

canonknipser wrote:
Fri Aug 18, 2017 2:50 pm
If you are able to make changes to the core (and if you know, what you do and do not just follow blindly some instructions), you should also be able to use a file comparison tool between your sources and the 3.2.0 source to identify the differences to copy over in the 3.2.1 source.

It's no magic, just know your tools.
I know what the problem is, I know what has changed and it will be fixed. But for others, using extensions? They have to wait or stop using them because many extensions end up unfinished or on the shelf. If I have to keep editing the code within various extensions that are not mine in order to keep then functioning every few phpBB updates then how does that make it any easier than back in the days of editing core files? I'm still editing php files, only now their located inside "extensions" rather than the phpBB main structure.

Must be very frustrating for extension authors with lots of extensions on the go! No wonder some of them are in the "under development" forum for close to 2 years or more.

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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.2.1 released

Post by thecoalman » Fri Aug 18, 2017 4:46 pm

canonknipser wrote:
Fri Aug 18, 2017 2:50 pm
If you are able to make changes to the core (and if you know, what you do and do not just follow blindly some instructions), you should also be able to use a file comparison tool between your sources and the 3.2.0 source to identify the differences to copy over in the 3.2.1 source.

It's no magic, just know your tools.
Agree, I simply have a file that lists any edits to phpbb files. Notaions in the files temsleve for what was changed and why. Download the changed file package and see if any files I have edited were changed. If so... use a file comparison tool like Winmerge or the plugin in Notepad++

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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.2.1 released

Post by canonknipser » Fri Aug 18, 2017 4:55 pm

WelshPaul wrote:
Fri Aug 18, 2017 2:57 pm
I'm still editing php files, only now their located inside "extensions" rather than the phpBB main structure.
Extension are not touched by the phpBB-Update, they have their own update system found in the maintenance tab in acp. So no need to re-edit any extension file during phpBB-Update from 3.2.0 to 3.2.1 (unless the extension itself is buggy and not able to work correctly with 3.2.1 :roll: )
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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.2.1 released

Post by thecoalman » Fri Aug 18, 2017 4:57 pm

DavidIQ wrote:
Fri Aug 18, 2017 1:03 am
Yep, but here we are with you complaining you're unable to update due to making likely totally avoidable edits to core files. ;) Also we've been saying to avoid editing them as much as possible for a few years now.
David, orientation of thumbnails using EXIF orientation has been issue for how many years?

Since I'm using Imagemagick.... 12 character fix to the core file

https://tracker.phpbb.com/browse/PHPBB3 ... lter=10001

Two character fix for return-path in email that I wold consider major bug if it effects you that goes back to 2011:

https://tracker.phpbb.com/browse/PHPBB3 ... lter=10001


I realize these simple edits may not apply to all environments but come on....

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Re: Discuss: phpBB 3.2.1 released

Post by WelshPaul » Fri Aug 18, 2017 5:06 pm

canonknipser wrote:
Fri Aug 18, 2017 4:55 pm
WelshPaul wrote:
Fri Aug 18, 2017 2:57 pm
I'm still editing php files, only now their located inside "extensions" rather than the phpBB main structure.
Extension are not touched by the phpBB-Update, they have their own update system found in the maintenance tab in acp. So no need to re-edit any extension file during phpBB-Update from 3.2.0 to 3.2.1 (unless the extension itself is buggy and not able to work correctly with 3.2.1 :roll: )
Extensions can and do break when updates are made to phpBB and it's dependencies, to say they can't and don't is foolish! Many extensions that once worked with 3.1 no longer work with 3.2! That doesn't mean they were buggy or poorly coded. If updating phpBB doesn't have any effect on extensions then why did they all of a sudden stop working? I can tell you for a fact that updating from one release of 3.1 to another (at times) broke extensions because the phpBB team implemented new changes or updated dependencies that altered the way extensions needed to be coded.

https://area51.phpbb.com/docs/dev/32x/e ... _rhea.html
phpBB 3.2 (Rhea) introduces many new and updated components that extensions can take advantage of. Some of these changes may require extensions to make updates to maintain compatibility with phpBB 3.2 (some changes provide a layer of backwards compatibility with 3.1). Extension authors should review the changes documented below to see how their extensions may be affected.
Good luck finding any major extension that works on 3.1.0 that still works on 3.1.11 without ever requiring an update, same no doubt for 3.2.0. Pretty sure that once 3.3 comes along, we will see the same thing again where the majority of 3.2 extensions won't work anymore.

There are validated 3.1 extensions listed in this forum: viewforum.php?f=536 that worked with earlier releases of 3.1.x but no longer work with later releases of 3.1.

The point i'm trying to make is that extensions aren't as fool proof or as easy as to create and maintain as some like to point out so I can relate to why some users of phpBB still prefer to edit core phpBB files at times.

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