Does phpBB violate PHP's license

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techboyg5
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Does phpBB violate PHP's license

Post by techboyg5 »

PHP's license says the following:

3. The name "PHP" must not be used to endorse or promote products
derived from this software without prior written permission. For
written permission, please contact group@php.net.

4. Products derived from this software may not be called "PHP", nor
may "PHP" appear in their name, without prior written permission
from group@php.net. You may indicate that your software works in
conjunction with PHP by saying "Foo for PHP" instead of calling
it "PHP Foo" or "phpfoo"

It looks like phpBB violates the PHP license. Is that true?
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ssl
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Re: Does phpBB violate PHP's license

Post by ssl »

Hi
It's a joke?
Sorry for my English ... I do my best!

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php version: 8.0.2
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DTMWC
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Re: Does phpBB violate PHP's license

Post by DTMWC »

I would assume phpBB have asked for permission, phpBB is like 20 years old so it's not like php wouldn't have noticed :lol:
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Talk19Zehn
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Re: Does phpBB violate PHP's license

Post by Talk19Zehn »

@techboyg5 and hello, before making such statements, the CREDITS.txt should be read and unilateral contractual changes are in my opinion ineffective.
Only the contents of the contract can answer this questions. Or what is now happened?

Greetings :?

Edit:
Furthermore, I am of the opinion that your own PHP additions, which may be subject to an extended license, must also be documented independently by the website operator. Nothing has changed about that, has it?

Best regards. :)
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Re: Does phpBB violate PHP's license

Post by Marshalrusty »

The phpBB name is over 20 years old and predates what you quoted.

If you're starting a project today, you should not use php in the name to comply with their request.
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Re: Does phpBB violate PHP's license

Post by AmigoJack »

techboyg5 wrote:
Mon Aug 17, 2020 1:22 pm
3. The name "PHP"
...
nor may "PHP" appear in their name
Am I the only one being able to distinguish names from initialisms? Neither "PHP" nor "phpBB" are names.
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techboyg5
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Re: Does phpBB violate PHP's license

Post by techboyg5 »

AmigoJack wrote:
Wed Aug 19, 2020 11:07 pm
techboyg5 wrote:
Mon Aug 17, 2020 1:22 pm
3. The name "PHP"
...
nor may "PHP" appear in their name
Am I the only one being able to distinguish names from initialisms? Neither "PHP" nor "phpBB" are names.
You're not right. PHP and phpBB are both names of software products.

Here's the PHP license. It's basically the 2 clause BSD license with four additional clauses, two of which are the ones at the top of this thread.
https://www.php.net/license/3_01.txt
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WelshPaul
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Re: Does phpBB violate PHP's license

Post by WelshPaul »

phpBB was initially released back in December of 2000. It doesn't matter what v3.01 states, provide a link to the license published at that time. Also, how do you even know they don't have written consent to use the name? If you think that phpBB has breached php's licensing agreement then head on over to php and let them know. Oh and don't forget to tell them about phpMyAdmin too! Somehow I doubt anyone at php headquarters hasn't heard of either before. :roll:
techboyg5
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Re: Does phpBB violate PHP's license

Post by techboyg5 »

WelshPaul wrote:
Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:02 pm
phpBB was initially released back in December of 2000. It doesn't matter what v3.01 states, provide a link to the license published at that time. Also, how do you even know they don't have written consent to use the name? If you think that phpBB has breached php's licensing agreement then head on over to php and let them know. Oh and don't forget to tell them about phpMyAdmin too! Somehow I doubt anyone at php headquarters hasn't heard of either before. :roll:
Here is version 3.0:
https://www.php.net/license/3_0.txt

As you can see, it has the exact same clauses as 3.01, and says this line in particular:
This is the original PHP License, version 3.0 which applies only to
very old versions of PHP software (such as versions 5.1.1, 4.4.1, and
earlier).

There is no versions 2.0 or 1.0 of the license, version 3.0 was the first version, followed by 3.01.
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Re: Does phpBB violate PHP's license

Post by KevC »

What is your issue with this? There's no question to answer. It's all above board.
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WelshPaul
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Re: Does phpBB violate PHP's license

Post by WelshPaul »

techboyg5 wrote:
Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:20 pm
There is no versions 2.0 or 1.0 of the license
Yes there was. Do your own homework!
techboyg5 wrote:
Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:20 pm
version 3.0 was the first version, followed by 3.01.
You have no idea what you're talking about!
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ssl
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Re: Does phpBB violate PHP's license

Post by ssl »

Hum ... very interesting this thread, I take out the popcorns :P
Sorry for my English ... I do my best!

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php version: 8.0.2
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Re: Does phpBB violate PHP's license

Post by AmigoJack »

techboyg5 wrote:
Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:20 pm
There is no versions 2.0 or 1.0 of the license, version 3.0 was the first version, followed by 3.01.
No: With the releases of phpBB 1.0.0 from 2000-06-17 to 2000-12-16 it is totally possible that only the GNU GPL as of PHP3 was known. But during the same period PHP4 also already existed, having its non-GPL license.
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david63
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Re: Does phpBB violate PHP's license

Post by david63 »

Just an observation "PHP" is not the same as "php"
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Re: Does phpBB violate PHP's license

Post by Heo32 »

Why are so many of you getting worked up over this simple question?

It either violates a PHP license or it does not.

Since phpBB has existed before those license conditions were made up, that would imply that phpBB is possibly exempt from those terms. But if not, then it would then imply that phpBB has contacted PHP to get permission. But if permission was not requested and granted, and if phpBB is not exempt, then regardless if this project is 20 years or 1 week old is irrelevant; permission must be requested in that case. And better late than never.

The PHP staff knows about phpBB, though. I've reported a PHP bug a few years back to them, and mentioned my forums, which uses phpBB. If there was a problem, it would likely have been dealt with by now. Obviously there has been no concern by them.

It is still worth asking if things are in check and in order. Instead of being on the offensive and attacking the author's topic, try acting mature, sincere and respectful towards techboyg5. I know it is popular these days to label others as bad guys, but his intentions are good. So chill out.
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