[REQUEST] Additional Forum types: BLOG and WIKI Forums

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Ghost11
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[REQUEST] Additional Forum types: BLOG and WIKI Forums

Post by Ghost11 » Wed Oct 03, 2007 8:22 pm

Hi,
I think sometimes a picture says more than thousand words …
image 1
Image

As most of you know, there are lots of content management systems (CMS) out there. Most of the very often (purposefully) used applications/media, like forums, blogs and wikis, basically DO NOT differ each other in regard of the primary purpose of very easy creating dynamic (text-)contents.
IMHO - forums, blogs and wikis basically only differ in their whole presentation (style, template, et cetera) and some more or less specific functionalities and (more or less sophisticated) user management/permission systems – but fundamentally they are all about creating (dynamic) content.

And of course - one of these specific types/media (forums, blogs, wikis) can be for some users and their projects more useful than the other types/media – BUT earlier or later people very often wish to have at least a 2nd type of system (e.g. blogs) WITHIN their whole phpBB environment - and not converse - e.g. phpBB integrated ("bridged") in WordPress, Serendipity, Joomla et cetera, just to create some blogs, or to allows members to add their very own blogs. And sometimes people would even like to have a 3rd type of system (e.g. Wikis) WITHIN their whole phpBB environment, in order to easy create some or lots of Wiki-pages for e.g. their project documentations or something like that only – BUT essentially for them is always to have all types WITHIN 1 phpBB environment with phpBB core functionalities (1 user management, 1 global search function, same template/style system et cetera)!

So why not having the 3 most purposefully used systems (just specified/modified/adapted phpBB forums) within 1 phpBB environment, so that in addition you are able to form all 3 types into 1 EASY to configure, expand, displace and administrate STRUCTURE?
image 2
Image

And YES - your blog forum part (blog categories - blog forums and finally your BLOGS instead of "TOPICS") could e.g. definitely look like as follows:
image 3
Image

I think you already have noticed that the picture above is just a screen shot of a topic view,
out of the User Blog Mod (Mod author: EXreaction)
This MOD could definitely represent a GREAT Mod - if there wouldn't be a fundamentalist problem (IMHO):
Omarvelous wrote: I wonder if it would somehow be possible to... have the mod work off a "Forum" or "Category"... Basically create a Forum/Category for Blogs only...
----------------
I think having blogs as a "category" in addition to your User Blog section will encourage a lot more interactivity with it, therefore generating more interest, turning interest into action, therefore creating more users who will more actively blog.

Just an idea....
EXreaction wrote:I won't get into blog categories or anything like that.
Source
So what can I say ... but anyway, basically a GREAT Mod.
--------------------------------------------

WIKI forums
Regarding the Wiki part - BTW - Which phpBB-blasphemy ( :P ) is THAT ??
(The idea behind is GREAT, but ... )
I mean, this would be the same case if Microsoft developers would develop Windows on Linux or Mac computers ...
But is it really necessary to use a Wiki software to build a phpBB documentation page? Oh, because "a wiki is a medium which can be edited by anyone with access to it, and provides an easy method for linking from one page to another ..."

Really? And all that is not possible with phpBB? What a shame ...
I think you already know what I mean. So this Mod, I'm speaking here about, should furthermore be able to create (1st) Wiki Categories, (2nd) Wiki Forums and finally (3rd) create (slim, specific) Wiki pages just for documentations, FAQ's et cetera purposes - means pages, which do NOT need all the features which are specific for discussion forums or blogs - or WITH them, because, WHY not?

IMPORTANT for the whole idea behind this MOD:
Every additional phpBB3 forum type ([blog category], [blog] / [wiki category], [wiki]) a user chose, has to work as STABLE as the "prime" phpBB forums. That means, the blog and wiki part should of course based on the "prime" phpBB(forums) - they are just specified/modified/adapted phpBB forums within the whole phpBB environment / structure.
================================

I'm not a programer, coder or Mod writer - so I think, the essential STEPS and thoughts for writing such a MOD should be:
---------------------------------
Step 1
This MOD should enable create/chose (as shown on the pictures above) all necessary forum types for creating blogs and wikis within the whole phpBB3 environment/structure .

Step 2
If a user chose e.g. the Forum type Blog Category and Blog - instead a typical phpBB topic view, a specified/modified/adapted topic/articel template view, as they are typical for BLOGS, should appear (e.g. as shown on the 'User Blog Mod' picture for blogs) if users create blogs.

Step 3
If a user chose e.g. the Forum type Wiki Category and Wiki - instead a typical phpBB topic view, a specified/modified/adapted topic/articel template view, as they are typical for WIKIS, should appear if users create new wiki articles/docs.
---------------------------------

I think EVERY interested user can already foresee, that if such a MOD would exist, and is working very well, you are able to EASY create/build/add every important medium you want and need for your site or project - the choice is yours!

- That means, you're basically able to create a complete blog community with e.g. just some forums for you Blog-Community, Technical Support et cetera.

- That means, you're basically able to create a complete wiki community with e.g. just some forums for your Wiki-Community, Technical Support et cetera.

- That means, you're able to create/add every essential for your project necessary medium you need - and you are always flexible.

- That means, you and your users must not register, link to and work on 3 different types of systems - you have everything within 1 easy to administrate environment.

Just an idea ... :roll:
Last edited by Ghost11 on Sat Oct 13, 2007 3:09 pm, edited 17 times in total.

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tom_mk
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Re: [IDEA] Additional Forum types: BLOG and WIKI Forums

Post by tom_mk » Thu Oct 04, 2007 1:40 am

truthfully, i've not finished reading ur post
cos i don't have time atm
but if u looking for blog + forum
eg. wordpress + phpbb
there is a mod which is still in beta stage called 'wp-united'
hope this help

Tom

Lord Le Brand
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Re: [IDEA] Additional Forum types: BLOG and WIKI Forums

Post by Lord Le Brand » Thu Oct 04, 2007 8:11 pm

You are missing one big point in your post. A wiki really is different from a blog, and a blog is really different from a forum, not only in functionality, but also in purpose (although the difference between blog and forum is much smaller than between a wiki and either). A Wiki for phpBB documentation is nothing more than logical, seeing that a wiki's purpose is to provide semi-static articles which can be edited by anyone.

That said, I too would like to see a wiki-blog-forum integration, and indeed, would like to see phpBB3 as the core of it (not unimportantly because the coding standards are the best I know of, and it's a solid base for anything). This would indeed bind all these together, but each "section" still with its own purpose.

On the blog idea, I kinda wonder how that all should be organised... (Who gets to post blog articles, do people get their own personal blog, etc)

Very interesting indeed. I'd work on it but all projects I start tend to fall apart after short time, at least if I do it on my own... (maybe if anyone else interested wants to work together I'd be glad to help out)

PS: I don't see any images :?
Image

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Re: [IDEA] Additional Forum types: BLOG and WIKI Forums

Post by Ghost11 » Fri Oct 05, 2007 12:13 am

Hi Lord Le Brand,
You don’t see the embedded images? hmm ... I CAN see them within my posting/browser (using FF) …
Just in case somebody is unable to see the 3 (embedded) images:
Image 1 / Image 2 / Image 3
Able to see them now?
-------------------------------------------------------------

Just to summarize the most essential points:

As I can read, you completely got the essential point behind the idea:
Lord Le Brand wrote:That said, I too would like to see a wiki-blog-forum integration, and indeed, would like to see phpBB3 as the core of it (not unimportantly because the coding standards are the best I know of, and it's a solid base for anything). This would indeed bind all these together, but each "section" still with its own purpose.
Here you can find the 2nd essential point behind the idea:
Omarvelous wrote: I think having blogs as a "category" in addition to your User Blog section will encourage a lot more interactivity with it, therefore generating more interest, turning interest into action, therefore creating more users who will more actively blog.
And finally, here you can find the 3rd and fundamental point behind the idea (additional Forum types to the 3 already existing phpBB 3 Forum types - so furthermore you're able to create a CLEAR structure within your phpBB 3 environment/index page!!):
Image 2
Image


Regarding different point of views about forums, blogs and wikis:

Web 2.0
Tim Berners-Lee, founder of the WWW said:
Tim Berners-Lee wrote:">Web 2.0< have existed since the early days of the Web”
Web 1.0 was all about connecting people
Means in short:
In fact - since the early days of the WWW, the WWW nowadays have just become much more interactive (e.g. VoIP, RSS ...).
BUT:
Tim Berners-Lee wrote:Web 1.0 was all about connecting people

… so NOTHING have ESSENTIALLY changed (in regard of its nature), and Tim Berners-Lee’s point of view is definitely right (IMHO).
And in this conjunction,
Ghost11, topic starter and “IDEA supplier” says:
Ghost11 wrote:IMHO - forums, blogs and wikis basically only differ in their whole presentation (style, template, et cetera), some more or less specific functionalities and (more or less sophisticated) user management/permission systems – but fundamentally they are all about creating (dynamic) content.
That means, everybody has just a different point of view about forums, blogs and wikis - but these types of mediums are all about creating (dynamic) contents. BTW - the term "dynamic" in this conjunction just means, that more or lot's of people are able to create, edit, ... pages - nothing more, nothing lesser.
---------------------
I think we shouldn't quarrel too much about different points of view about forums, blogs and wikis, or just different points of view about just terms. Instead, we should concentrate on the essential points for creating such an effective and REALLY useful "all in one" MOD.
Lord Le Brand wrote: I kinda wonder how that all should be organised... (Who gets to post blog articles, do people get their own personal blog, etc)
These questions are easy to explain (IMHO):
As you know, phpBB 3 has a very sophisticated user and user rights mangement system. That means, for e.g the whole blog part (within the whole phpBB 3 environment), you're able to manage your users in every direction (e.g. groups et cetera). And YES, people should get their own "blogs" - as easy as they are able to create forum topics! Let's say, similar as forum topics (pages) - just with some more blog specific functionalities.

I could tell you much more about the core functionalities this MOD should have (most of the necessary functionalities already exists within phpBB 3!) - but step by step ...
Lord Le Brand wrote:... at least if I do it on my own... (maybe if anyone else interested wants to work together I'd be glad to help out)
I think, EXreaction COULD be the one ... ;)
Last edited by Ghost11 on Sat Oct 13, 2007 1:43 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: [IDEA] Additional Forum types: BLOG and WIKI Forums

Post by GGDub » Fri Oct 05, 2007 1:03 am

all id just like to have is each user have there own blog, and it shows up in there profile...

then a page with like:
top 10 most commented
top 10 viewed

or someting...

Ghost11
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Re: [IDEA] Additional Forum types: BLOG and WIKI Forums

Post by Ghost11 » Fri Oct 05, 2007 4:15 pm

Hi GirlsGoneWeed,
Look at the last sentence (link within) of my previous post – there you will find a already working Mod who will fulfil all YOUR in short written needs …

But DO NOT forget – you’ll be unable to STUCTURE (within categories/forums) all your personal blogs (or all by your users created blogs)!

The (Random Blogs)-(Recent Blogs) and (Popular Blogs)-part would be a VERY NICE IDEA to have them e.g. on your main page (or wherever you wish to have them). But as I already have clear mentioned in my previous postings – the Mod author has (sadly) thereby jumped over a very essential part behind the whole (really great) blog idea (no categories/forum structure) …
====================================

As most of you already know, everything in phpBB3 is forum based ...
In phpBB3 there are no categories, everything is forum based. Each forum can have an unlimited number of sub-forums and you can determine whether each may be posted to or not (i.e. whether it acts like an old category). Here you can add, edit, delete, lock, unlock individual forums as well as set certain additional controls. If your posts and topics have got out of sync you can also resynchronise a forum. You need to copy or set appropriate permissions for newly created forums to have them displayed.Board index
Everything in phpBB 3 is forum based? GREAT!

And this fact has been the basic idea behind this MOD. As mentioned in my previous posts:
So WHY not add some more (specific) Forum types in phpBB3?
And furthermore - thereby to get a CLEAR structure within your whole phpBB (index page)?

The simple steps for a user who use this MOD would be as follows:

STEP 1
image 2
Image

STEP 2 (result)
image_ board_index
Image
[Just an EXAMPLE Board index page!]

So the choice is yours,
how you structure all the different (additional) phpBB3 Forum types (blog pages, wiki pages, static pages)!
Some specific categories and forums within your Board index page are HIDDEN for users, some do not (you are able to define them as wished) ...

Maybe I’m speaking here about a kind of “phpBB-CMS-Mod” – but with the result VERY EASY to create and administrate specific pages (e.g. blogs, wikis) WITHIN 1 phpBB environment / structure (index page)!

That means, all this MOD should enable in simple words:

- This MOD let a user/admin create additional Forum types (to the 3 already existing phpBB3 Forum types);

- These additional, INDEPENDENT and specific Forum types, which are just based on the standard phpBB3 Forum types (“Category” and “Forum”), should enable just a little bit more or less SPECIFIC adapted e.g. blog, wiki or just simple static pages etc, than the phpBB3 standard Forum types/pages do (maybe the different pages itself are functional just adapted via add-ons, hacks etc – or whatever a programmer, coder, Mod writer would suggest to chose);

“That’s all” in short … ;)

Just imagine:
If you e.g. go to (click) a specific topic (aka a “blog”) within your Blog Categories/Forum type, the page you’ll see COULD look like THIS PAGE or THIS PAGE – maybe just a little bit more phpBB 3 adapted the blog article part (means, just similar to a normal phpBB topic page view).

Or just imagine this:
If you e.g. go to (click) a specific PAGE link within your PAGE Categories/Forum type (or wherever you have placed them), such a STATIC page you or your users will see COULD look like THIS PAGE. That means, you are able to creat just simple "static" pages - without any "Post reply" buttons or something like that.

BTW - this MOD could be one of the BEST phpBB MODs ever!

----------------------
p.s. - I think the best way to completely document and explain such a MOD project would be in the form of a wiki or blog and/or some easy to create doc pages - but SORRY ( :cry: ), my fresh installed phpBB3 does not support any kind of such specific systems and pages ( :roll: ), so some interested people could easy work together for creation and development of this phpBB3 MOD ...
Last edited by Ghost11 on Mon Oct 08, 2007 9:24 am, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: [IDEA] Additional Forum types: BLOG and WIKI Forums

Post by phpDummie » Fri Oct 05, 2007 10:42 pm

Ghost11 wrote:...
As most of you know, there are lots of content management systems (CMS) out there. Most of the very often (purposefully) used systems, like forums, blogs and wikis, basically DO NOT differ each other in regard of the primary purpose of very easy creating dynamic (text-)contents.
...
http://www.phpbb.com/community/viewtopi ... 0#p2700210

I am not an expert in phpbb3 permissions, but it seems to me that what you are asking for is the category's to be able to set ownership and moderator rights for the participants. In the "Blog" category the topic starter would have the right to allow or disallow comments and have moderator's functions. In "Wiki" category, anyone would be able to edit everybody else's post as his own. Everything else is just presentation.

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Re: [IDEA] Additional Forum types: BLOG and WIKI Forums

Post by Omarvelous » Sat Oct 06, 2007 3:03 pm

Ghost11....

I see i'm not the only crazy one around here! :D

I completely get what you saying... I mean it might not be necessary to have this MOD ... to ALL, BUT that's why it would be a MOD, for those who would want to utilize it. And I think for those who do, will realize a great benefit in it.

It will help create an "all inclusive" site and experience for most users, thus...
will encourage a lot more interactivity with it, therefore generating more interest, turning interest into action, therefore creating more users who will more actively blog.
Another kind of idea... for a blog style template thingy...
http://portableapps.com/node/9401

Notice how he first post is styled? Then the proceeding replies are regular forum style or close to blog comment style?

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Re: [IDEA] Additional Forum types: BLOG and WIKI Forums

Post by Ghost11 » Mon Oct 08, 2007 11:56 pm

Hi guys, ;)

Just to summarize as short as possible ALL previous postings, in regard to this MOD [IDEA / REQUEST]:

Fact 1 - The Need

Is the following a fact or is it not a fact?
"Lot’s of phpBB users would definitely like to see at least a 2nd (specific) type of application/media (either BLOGS or WIKIS and/or the possibility easy to create simple STATIC PAGES) within ONE phpBB environment. Or let’s say:
The most by users utilized types of applications/media within ONE easy to create/handle/administrate CLEAR STRUCTURE under ONE ROOF …"

image 5
Image
Comments:
phpDummie wrote:I have lately been searching for a CMS and a blog to complement the forum. After looking at an gargantuan number of all the offerings out there and realizing that the blog is basically a forum with the author automatically being the admin of only his (sub-)forum and a CMS can be considered a member blog with some fancy layout features and considering the difficulties of integrating the best solutions in each category, I ended up with a wish for a future forum systems: more flexible authorization/permission system and more diverse, modular perhaps, layout features. So that I can mold it onto a blog or CMS or forum or some cross-bread of all three running on the same engine.
---------------------------
Source - Really interesting discussion!
Anon wrote:...
What I do think will happen is forums will grow to be the centre of a site. ...What I predict is instead of the forum being just an addon, it'll become the backend, with other things like e-commerce, live chat, CMS and all the other things being addons. You can see this happening already - look how many features phpBB 3 has over 2, and think how 3.2, 3.4, 4.0 and beyond will turn out.
Source
Fact 2 - Additional phpBB3 Forum types

In order basically to enable/get such a CLEAR STRUCTURE of pages of different applications (media) under ONE ROOF (image 5), additional Forum types to the 3 already existing phpBB3 Forum types ("Category", "Forum" and "Link") would be necessary, resp. would be efficient:
image 3
Image

Fact 3 - Software Base: phpBB3

The CLEAR message to fact 3 is (especially to Mod writers/programmers):
Lord Le Brand wrote:That said, I too would like to see a wiki-blog-forum integration, and indeed, would like to see phpBB3 as the core of it (not unimportantly because the coding standards are the best I know of, and it's a solid base for anything). This would indeed bind all these together, but each "section" still with its own purpose.
Additionally to this statement:
Ghost11 wrote:IMPORTANT for the whole idea behind this MOD:
Every additional phpBB3 forum type ([blog category], [blog] / [wiki category], [wiki]) a user chose, has to work as STABLE as the "prime" phpBB forums. That means, the blog and wiki part should of course based on the "prime" phpBB(forums) - means, they are just specified/modified/adapted phpBB forums within the whole phpBB environment / structure. [<-- maybe via plugins and/or add-ons!!]
And in addition to both statements, all (additional) Forum types have to work completely INDEPENDENT from all the other Forum types (already existing and additional types), although they are within 1 phpBB3 environment - because of fact 4 ...

Fact 4 - Different points of view regarding priorities, functionalities, styles/templates ...

Comments:
Lord Le Brand wrote: ... but each "section" still with its own purpose.
GirlsGoneWeed wrote:all id just like to have is each user have there own blog, and it shows up in there profile...
or someting... ["or something" WHAT ??]
Omarvelous wrote:Another kind of idea... for a blog style template thingy...
http://portableapps.com/node/9401
Notice how he first post is styled?
kazary wrote:Very good ^^, i was waiting for a mod of this type. Some suggestions:
- visual personalization(customizable) of blog for each user
- a gallery of photos(pictures)
- calendar
Source
Ghost11 wrote:... your Blog Categories/Forum type, the page you’ll see COULD look like THIS PAGE or THIS PAGE – maybe just a little bit more phpBB 3 adapted the blog article part ...
In order to summarize fact 4:
The reason WHY each Forum type (each “section”) should work INDEPENDENT from all the other types is CLEAR:
Each type of media MUST be independent customizable from the other media (Forum types/"sections") in regard to specific FORUM features/Mods/hacks/add-ons, specific BLOG features/mods/hacks/add-ons, specific WIKI features/Mods/hacks/add-ons AND specific STATIC PAGES features/Mods/hacks/add-ons – but everything within 1 phpBB3 environment! :!:
Omarvelous wrote:... that's why it would be a MOD, for those who would want to utilize it.
And I think for those who do, will realize a great benefit in it.
===============================================================

In order to realize such a MOD idea - just 2 essential questions:

Valued programmers, coders, phpBB3 developers and Mod writers,

1) Is it basically possible to generate/create additional phpBB3 Forum types (let's say "clone" the already existing Forum types in the first step) as shown and described on the images obove?

2) If the answer is "YES" - is it possible to let them work INDEPENDENT from all existing and additional Forum types (in regard "independent customization"), but within only 1 phpBB3 environment (and core functionalities)?

Thank's in advance!

------------------------------------
P.s: I going to add quotations from every following and essential posting by other interested users to THIS posting and its listed FACTS, in order to centralize all the essential points and Mod project progresses within 1 posting - just an idea ...
Last edited by Ghost11 on Wed Oct 17, 2007 8:00 am, edited 4 times in total.

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Re: [IDEA] Additional Forum types: BLOG and WIKI Forums

Post by Ghost11 » Fri Oct 12, 2007 1:00 pm

Ghost11 wrote:In order to realize such a MOD idea - just 2 essential questions:

Valued programmers, coders, phpBB3 developers and Mod writers,

1) Is it basically possible to generate/create additional phpBB3 Forum types (let's say "clone" the already existing Forum types in the first step) as shown and described on the images obove?

2) If the answer is "YES" - is it possible to let them work INDEPENDENT from all existing and additional Forum types (in regard "independent customization"), but within only 1 phpBB3 environment (and core functionalities)?

Thank's in advance!
Hi, ;)
hmm, I’m not really sure if the 2 questions above are clear formulated asked (sorry, English is not my prime language :oops: ) – or maybe everything behind the whole idea is too complicated explained …

As I have mentioned in my previous postings (and I will try it again):

In order to work independent on additional Forum types (and that is the essential point, in regard creating/add specific types of media!), but everything within 1 phpBB3 environment (“under 1 roof” with phpBB3’s core functionalities), I think, but I’m not sure, the 1 step would be to let a Mod add/create (let’s say “clone”) the already existing Forum types (“Category” and “Forum”), so that in the next (2nd) step Mod writers could work independent (from existing and other types) on every (by users wished) Forum types, like blogs, wikis et cetera – again, but everything within only 1 core phpBB3 environment.

I think, it’s truly not easy to give an answer to all this, because the coding of phpBB3 must be pretty NEW for most programmers, coders and Mod writers – right?

So I think the only one (?), who could give a clear answer, would be by the phpBB3 developers itself (e.g. “Acidburn”, "naderman") – I think …

Any idea? :roll:

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Re: [IDEA] Additional Forum types: BLOG and WIKI Forums

Post by dataweaver » Mon Jan 28, 2008 10:36 pm

Ghost11 wrote:1) Is it basically possible to generate/create additional phpBB3 Forum types (let's say "clone" the already existing Forum types in the first step) as shown and described on the images above?
With hacking, all things are possible. It just depends on how much code you'll need to rewrite.

'includes/acp/constants.php' defines FORUM_CAT, FORUM_POST, and FORUM_LINK. You could easily add FORUM_BLOG and FORUM_WIKI to that and then modifying a few lines here and there to let phpbb know what's special about these.

Unfortunately, the code is currently written with a lot of "if thus-and-such == FORUM_POST" tests, under the premise that the only kind of forum that's going to behave at all like FORUM_POST is going to be FORUM_POST. It'll take some careful coding to get around this limitation; but it ought to be doable without having to rewrite everything.

For example, one could do this by following every statement that reads the 'forum_type' field from the 'forums' table with a statement that 'unpacks' its value into a type (one of the existing three) and a subtype, and preceding every statement that writes to that field with a statement that packs a type and subtype into its value. Or you could simply modify the table to include a separate 'forum_subtype' field, and modify all relevant queries to read or update that field as well as 'forum_type'.

The rest of the code could then be left as is, save for where a given subtype's behavior diverges from its underlying type. The only remaining potential complication comes from the question of how many separate places in the code read from or write to the 'forums' table.
Ghost11 wrote:2) If the answer is "YES" - is it possible to let them work INDEPENDENT from all existing and additional Forum types (in regard "independent customization"), but within only 1 phpBB3 environment (and core functionalities)?
I'm not sure what you're asking here. Once a distinction between forum types and subtypes is introduced into the code, you should be able to have, say, A Blog behave exactly like a traditional Forum except where you override the normal behavior using the forum's subtype.

For example: you might modify Blogs such that when you view a Blog-like forum, you see the first post of each topic instead of merely the topic's title. But otherwise, Blogs would be treated exactly like forums.

--

Consider this parallel:
Wiki ---> Page ---> Discussion
Blog ---> Entry --> Commentary
Forum --> Topic + initial Post --> followup Posts

Forums differ from Blogs and Wikis in that the former doesn't discriminate between the first post and the followup posts, whereas Blogs and Wikis draw a strong line between the initial submission and any talk that it may or may not inspire. So Blogs and Wikis would both need to tweak viewtopic to give special treatment to the first post, effectively popping it off of the stack and treating it as a distinct entity. This goes beyond mere viewing purposes; for instance, sorting by "post time" in a Blog or Wiki should sort based on the date of the initial post; a second "sort by recent comments" option would provide the more traditional forum sorting behavior.

Beyond that, there are a few other features that traditional Blogs and Wikis have that merit special attention:

Blogs are typically syndicated (i.e. RSS/Atom). Not something we need to worry about; IIRC, there's already a project underway intended to allow any Forum or Topic to be syndicated. Since phpbb Blogs will be Forums, installing that MOD alongside this one will work nicely.

Blog entries sometimes carry "keyword tags", to more easily allow for grouping, filtering, and indexing by subject matter. While I know of no project that's in the works to do this sort of thing with Forums, I'd much rather see it handled that way rather than as a Blog-specific feature, if it's worth doing at all. (Incidently, some Blogs have a similar concept, such as MediaWiki's Categories.)

Wiki pages have built-in versioning, allowing an editor to roll back changes. As with the "keyword tags" idea, this might be better as a "companion Mod" that enables versioning on all posts, rather than being a Wiki-specific feature. It would also be a sizable task on its own, and one that would be made harder by having to distinguish between Wiki pages and Forum posts or Blog entries.

Finally, Wiki pages have the ability to link to other Wiki pages by name. Not "by numeric id"; by name. Mind you, they tend to run into problems when the target page gets renamed; but there's a certain "ease factor" involved in not having to look up a page's numeric id in order to point to it. IMHO, this ought to be another "companion Mod", thus allowing any post to link to any forum or topic - be it a Category, a Link, a Forum, a Blog, a Blog entry, a Wiki, a Wiki page, or any other "forum type" extension that someone might come up with in the future.

(On the subject of these "internal links", my own preference would be to allow two formats: one format that uses something akin to a path (i.e. "Widget" to link to a "sister topic" called Widget; "." to link to the Forum that this topic is in; ".." to link to your Forum's parent Forum; "/" to link to the Board Index; and so on), and a second which uses a resource identifier: "f=72" for Forum 72; "t=583123" for Topic 583123; "p=3216454" for Post 3216454; etc. Then have phpbb automagically convert the first format into the second when the post is saved. This would keep the ease of use inherent in the first format, and would allow people to freely rename topics and forums (well, as freely as one can rename such things) without worrying about breaking links to them.)

You can cover a lot of ground simply by using the existing Permissions system. Want a Wiki where anyone can edit any page? Set the "edit posts" permissions for that wiki to allow changes from anyone. Want a Blog centered around a single user? Set that Blog's "Start New Topics" permissions such that only he can do so. Want to remove the ability to post comments about a Blog entry? Kill all permissions that involve replying to it. Want people to be able to create static pages? Tell them to create Wiki pages and give them permission to Lock the ones they've created. Voila! A webpage that isn't freely editable.
Last edited by dataweaver on Tue Jan 29, 2008 2:47 am, edited 1 time in total.

Veretax
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Re: [REQUEST] Additional Forum types: BLOG and WIKI Forums

Post by Veretax » Mon Jan 28, 2008 11:58 pm

I believe that you could accomplish this, but as with any mod its going to take an awful lot of hacking. I don't know enough about PHP to say what the easiest way to allow this to happen, but in .Net terms you'd need a way to have delegates or generics to handle the various types of posts etc. Does that make sense to anyone but me?

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Re: [REQUEST] Additional Forum types: BLOG and WIKI Forums

Post by Ghost11 » Wed Jan 30, 2008 5:58 am

First of all, many thanks to dataweaver!

Wow! This is simply the best clarification about the whole topic I could read during the last month. :!:
I hope some (interested and motivated) programers/coders and mod writer discover this topic (especially in regard dataweaver's basic solution approaches) as real challenge.

Thanks again, and
best regards!

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EXreaction
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Re: [REQUEST] Additional Forum types: BLOG and WIKI Forums

Post by EXreaction » Wed Jan 30, 2008 11:04 pm

It would not be difficult to make a forum look like a blog.

The problem comes in when you try to make it "act" like a blog. The main problem would be that blogs are designed to not focus on categories, but focus on users. About the only possible way to work around that without rebuilding everything would be to have something automatically create a new forum for each user.

One thing I can guarantee, it sounds a heck of a lot easier than it would be.

A wiki would be much easier because they are designed around categories, not users.

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Re: [REQUEST] Additional Forum types: BLOG and WIKI Forums

Post by dataweaver » Thu Jan 31, 2008 2:25 am

EXreaction wrote:It would not be difficult to make a forum look like a blog.

The problem comes in when you try to make it "act" like a blog. The main problem would be that blogs are designed to not focus on categories, but focus on users. About the only possible way to work around that without rebuilding everything would be to have something automatically create a new forum for each user.
Not so. I see no reason why you can't have a "Personal Blogs" Category to hold the individual Blogs. In fact, it would be desirable to do so, to keep them all in one place and out of the way. Remember that you can arrange for the category to be hidden from view.

The key to making Blogs "user-oriented" would be to tailor each one's permissions so that only the blogger can create new topics in it, and to provide access to it through the blogger's profile. The latter would involve having each blog specify on which user's profile page the access will be provided.

That said, it would be onerous to involve the Administrator in the creation of each and every Blog. To that end, here's what I'd recommend:

the Minimal approach:
Add a tab to the ACP that lets the Admin specify which Forum will hold the Personal Blogs (it will probably be a Category; but I'm not assuming so), and a default set of permissions for bloggers. Add a tab to the UCP that lets the user create a Blog (if he doesn't have one) or delete it (if he does). The prospective Blogger can specify the Blog's name, and nothing else.

When a user creates a Blog, the Blog's 'Parent' field gets set to the "holder Forum"; its 'Blogger' field gets set to the user that is creating it; and its permissions are inherited from the "holder Forum", then modified so that the blogger has the default blogger permissions.

Bells and Whistles:
  • Allow the Administrator to specify an arbitrary set of Permissions that get applied to the blogger when a new Blog gets created.
  • Allow the blogger to customize his Blog's permissions. This would have to come with an Administrative ability to restrict the range of permissions that the blogger can choose from. Without this option, the blogger would still be able to customize the permissions indirectly by asking the administrator to do it for him.
  • Modify the registration process to allow for the addition of a Personal Blog when the user's account is first set up. Separate, but related, would be an option that lets the Admin decide what happens to the Blogs of suspended or canceled accounts. Options would include "leave it be", "lock it", or "delete it".
  • Enable "shared blogs" by allowing groups to be specified as bloggers. The ability to create or delete a shared blog would be available via group administration, but only for the group leader.

Locked

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