Expedited Validation Continues

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Nuttzy99
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Expedited Validation Continues

Post by Nuttzy99 » Sun Nov 16, 2003 5:06 am

The best way the MOD Team can serve the community right now is to clear the MOD Validation Queue. Then the job will be to keep it running smoothly to the point where time spent in the queue is minimized. Right now there are about 50 MODs in the queue and a great many of those are MODs that were previously denied during our recent validation blitz.

The MOD Team has set the goal of getting the queue completely empty. This will include any submissions or resubmissions added along the way. We have an internal date of when we'd like to accomplish this, but since it is fairly ambitious I'd rather not make it a public goal. Let's just say that by year end we'd like to be working on something else :D

Once this mission is completed, we will then look for other ways in which we can improve the community. Obviously we'll want the community to be involved, so when the time comes we'll be asking for what you'd like to see. (BTW, "when the time comes" means "not yet" :P ) Until then, just know we're working hard to serve you!

Thanks,
-Nuttzy :cool:
Last edited by Nuttzy99 on Wed Mar 24, 2004 12:56 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Nuttzy99 » Mon Dec 15, 2003 7:47 pm

The battle continues on this. Clearing the queue has been difficult. Many new MODs have been submitted. The big thing is that many MODs have also been denied and resubmitted several times. This creates a lot of added work for the Team. But we are making progress. Hopefully we can give everyone a nice holiday present :D

-Nuttzy :cool:
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Post by Nuttzy99 » Wed Dec 17, 2003 7:12 pm

Well in the past week, something like 40 MODs have been submitted to the queue. So just as we were near having the queue empty, we were suddenly flooded again. We're still chipping away at it ;)

-Nuttzy :cool:
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Post by Cross_+_Flame » Wed Dec 17, 2003 8:52 pm

I have a question about the current policy on expediting the queue.

Several of Ptirhiik's newest mods were allowed through without "thorough testing" and just based on his reputation. While i agree with his personal reputation, as you see here at this post that there are problems with letting mods through the DB that were not thoroughly tested.

(Yes, I have read the post here regarding Ptirhiik, thanks :) My question regards the ethics of expediting the queue not Ptirhiik personally)

As well, in my newest mod changes made by the db team to make my mod a bit more streamlined were not tested and resulted in errors for the users, as evidenced here.

While I'm sure there are individual reasons for both (including my yet-to-be-submitted fix for my mod :oops: ), the few errors that have slipped through the cracks are a bit troublesome, and could be portents of future problems.

I know its a new team with new leadership after John left, and we might just be seeing this as a small aftereffect of the switcheroo. I also know how busy everyone is with lots of mods to do, and in an open-source community the only affirmation you get is "thank you's" from the mod community (thank you, btw :)). But, no offense, but I'd personally rather see the mods take a bit longer and be thoroughly tested before they are added to the DB with problems still attached and could be seen as embarassments to mod authors like myself.

I guess at the end of this post, my initial question is "why are we in such a hurry to get these mods out" as it has been a given that mods take a long time to validate around here and I was quite alright with my mods taking 2-3 months to validate. I guess I just value quality over quantity, and I think others would as well, as that's what seperates PHPBB from other modification websites: superior quality from rigorous testing. 8)

Please, before a response, understand I'm not criticizing the mod team or their current policies, and I respect them greatly for the great service work they do (and no, I don't have any idea how much work it actually is ;)); I'm just offering up some observations from the peanut gallery about the quality-assurance particulars of this mod validation process.

Cheers! :D

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Post by morpheus2matrix » Wed Dec 17, 2003 9:58 pm

Cross_+_Flame wrote: But, no offense, but I'd personally rather see the mods take a bit longer and be thoroughly tested before they are added to the DB with problems still attached and could be seen as embarassments to mod authors like myself.



You must know that before being available to members, MOD's are tested by at least 2 MOD's Team Members.

For validate a MOD, we are not only tested the MOD on a phpBB : we examine all the files which came from the MOD, we check all the modifications the MOD apport to phpBB (that's why Ptirhiik's MOD's are too complex to validate) but we are only humans. So maybe errors can still exists in the MOD's because we have not find them but in that case, we could said : "there is an error in the MOD, it's the MOD-Author's fault who have created the MOD" :wink:
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Post by Ptirhiik » Wed Dec 17, 2003 10:00 pm

Not mentioning the quote by this *hum* isn't one on a vanilia phpBB. Low sight, low reflexion.

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Post by Cross_+_Flame » Wed Dec 17, 2003 10:05 pm

morpheus2matrix wrote: You must know that before being available to members, MOD's are tested by at least 2 MOD's Team Members.

For validate a MOD, we are not only tested the MOD on a phpBB : we examine all the files which came from the MOD, we check all the modifications the MOD apport to phpBB (that's why Ptirhiik's MOD's are too complex to validate) but we are only humans. So maybe errors can still exists in the MOD's because we have not find them but in that case, we could said : "there is an error in the MOD, it's the MOD-Author's fault who have created the MOD" :wink:


;) Good point, M2M, and thank you for your considerate response. I apologize if I said anything offensive to your hard work.

So, yes, the errors *do* begin with the mod author, so I appreciate being let in on another checks and balances aspect of the mod team. Kudoes! :D

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Post by Nuttzy99 » Wed Dec 17, 2003 10:56 pm

Let's set the record straight here. MODs used to languish in the queue for months on end. There was one time when we had to do a mass delete of MODs in the queue b/c they were just too old. When I took the reigns, I inherited a backlog of MODs. We've been working to clear the backlog and get on top of things. If things continued status quo, then I really don't think it would have been possibe to ever clear the queue. The hole would simply get deeper and deeper.

In fact, to my knowledge, we have *never* been completely up to date on all MODs ever since we began doing validation 8O That needs to change. Once clearing the queue is accomplished, then we will not only be more stringent about validation, we can also do other things than validation.

Other sites have a policy of "user beware" when downloading MODs and they will pull a MOD from the DB if problems are learned of later. I don't see a problem with us doing this one time, for one trusted author. It is a tradeoff, but in the end, this is how we can best serve the community.

-Nuttzy :cool:
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Post by Cross_+_Flame » Wed Dec 17, 2003 11:41 pm

Nuttzy99 wrote: Other sites have a policy of "user beware" when downloading MODs and they will pull a MOD from the DB if problems are learned of later. I don't see a problem with us doing this one time, for one trusted author. It is a tradeoff, but in the end, this is how we can best serve the community.


That is the crux of the problem, and exactly what I was worried about: phpbb losing its identity as a trusted mod source, through and through. I'm heartily relieved to read that is not the case, and you will be as faithful as always with the mods you are producing. I have nothing against this present action; just concerned if it was moving towards policy or not, which you just assured me it isn't.

Thanks for the note...I do appreciate it, and I now recognize the fine line you walk with mods here. Gives me more respect for you than before, in fact ;)

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Post by iliasch » Thu Dec 18, 2003 7:02 am

Can I make a couple of suggestions that can help you and the users? :)

First, for each MOD validated and posted in this forum, include the version in the subject. Since you edit the first post of each every time it's updated, you can easily include the version in the subject. This way the MOD Release (...) forum will display the MODs along with their version, so users (and you) can easily know if a MOD has been updated, without having to visit each thread to find out. It saves time and bandwidth (which I think phpBB Group recently complained about).

Second, maintain a public forum called MOD History or something. Every time you receive a MOD, add it as a topic there like this:

Subject:
foo MOD version x.y.z

Body: (...)
Author: (...)
Version: (...)
Description: (...)
Submitted: (Date)
Assigned to: (MOD-Team Member)
Status: Pending (ETA 30 days)

The benefits of this:
1. Authors can see if their MOD is in the Queue so they do not resubmit.
2. Users can see what MODs are pending.
3. Other authors can avoid submitting a MOD that does the same as another MOD that has already been submitted.
4. If an author still resubmits the same MOD, you will find out when you try to add it to that forum, so you can delete it (or update the old one if the version has changed).

Of course, the suggested forum shall be Read-Only (ie only MOD-Team can post and reply).

I'm sure everyone can think of a reason to say that this is not worth it, but IMHO it should be.

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Post by Napoleon » Thu Dec 18, 2003 7:21 am

Thats a good idea iliasch, but I think it also takes time away from the MOD team since they would then need to take time to make a new post plus listing the two MOD Team members working on it, might get them a flood of PM's from the MOD Author of the MOD their looking at.

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Post by smithy_dll » Thu Dec 18, 2003 10:14 am

iliasch, that cannot become a reality simply because we are not going to be adding extra forums.

the current queue contents are posted in MOD Author Support (guess why? because it concerns MOD Authors).

The bandwidth involved is minimal, and not a complaint.

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Post by iliasch » Thu Dec 18, 2003 5:04 pm

Davidls wrote: iliasch, that cannot become a reality simply because we are not going to be adding extra forums.

the current queue contents are posted in MOD Author Support (guess why? because it concerns MOD Authors).

The bandwidth involved is minimal, and not a complaint.


It was just an idea, not necessarily a request. I've noticed the relative post in the mod authors, but it hasn't been updated recently. It would be fine, if someone updated it every 2-3 days.

Besides that, what about the first tip about adding the version number to the topics in MOD Announcements?

@Napoleon: I'm sure most MOD authors are mature enough to respect a notice saying "Do not message the MOD-team unless it's serious" or something like that.

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Post by Cross_+_Flame » Thu Dec 18, 2003 6:46 pm

it could be a good idea; however, I'm all about less bureaucracy on the mod team's part and the less paperwork they have to do, the better.

The queue thread is written as being updated monthly, which I find to be quite sufficient. I'd rather them get my mod out as a quality product than give me updates as to when it will be released.

So, as I said, a good idea, but not one that fits with phpbb's philosophy as I see it ;)

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Post by Nuttzy99 » Thu Dec 18, 2003 7:42 pm

Rather than put effort into Queue tracking, my ultimate goal is going to have have a max 7 day turnaround. We are far from reaching that at this point though. Once we are caught up, we can then develop tools and processes to make this a reality.

-Nuttzy :cool:
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